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Psychology and Tiny Houses

 
Posts: 47
Location: North Central North Carolina Zone 7B
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Personal preference, what is small and crowded to one is overly spacious to another.


To paraphrase: I once complained about the size of my tiny home until I met a homeless man...

 
pollinator
Posts: 3013
Location: Meppel (Drenthe, the Netherlands)
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Kena, I understand for a family staying all at home (in quarantine) you don't think of a tiny house. But for a single person it might be the opposite.
Someone who likes being alone, who can work from home / at home, who doesn't need a lot of stuff or large things ... and if there's a garden around the tiny house to grow the needed food ... then being in quarantine in a tiny house can be an ideal situation.
 
pollinator
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Location: Boston, Massachusetts
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As a partner of someone whose work shifted to work-from-home and Zoom meetings, I'll say that discrete space for WFH is going to become more important. Her desk got hurriedly setup in our living room, which is adjacent to kitchen, and the hallway to bath and bedrooms. During calls/classes/meetings use of kitchen was not possible save for quiet tasks, and transit to bath or bedrooms was in view of camera, and therefore off limits.
Our house has openings between kitchen, dining, living rooms, but by no means "open-plan". Luckily we have a second bath in finished basement, so it's not a total disaster. If my job was possible from home, we could operate on separate levels and do fine. My coworker's spouse is WFH and their condo IS open-plan, so she either has to retreat to bedroom or go outside while he is on calls.
Thankfully we have plenty of outside space as well, and plenty to be done in it!!  
 
gardener
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Location: South of Capricorn
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i was wondering the same thing. I suppose the good thing about tiny houses is that they generally have some sort of access to the outdoors, and are probably way less limiting than a small apartment with no balcony, for example.
My house is quite small (about 500 square feet), and we are pretty careful about clutter and organization, but for me it has always been 100% worth it to have my own work space that is separate from where I sleep and relax. I am seeing colleagues have a real hard time working from their bedroom or sofa or kitchen table and I`m glad that I insisted on having separate office space (if tiny-- 2.5x just under 3m- same size as my bathroom) from the beginning. This in a tiny house could probably just as easily be something involving a folding screen or something, but I know for me I want my work life separate from everything else.
Our outdoor covered porch is getting a workout, as it always does, as a work/garden/animal/brewing/pantry/etc space.
 
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Location: Zone 9a, Florida
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This is a very interesting topic. My husband and I started living in a 30' travel trailer in September of 2021. It has a single slide, which makes it feel much larger, but all in all is less than 200sqft of walkable living space. Before moving in to this setup, we rented a 1500sqft 3/2 in a large city. We spent about a month getting rid of most of the stuff we own and all we kept is important documents, childhood memory stuff, and my art studio.

Overall, we love it. The close proximity has only been a problem a few times, but we live on 10 acres so if we get tired of one another and need some introvert time, we can go out into the woods and do some axe throwing, work in our garden, or visit any of the animals we have on the property (I'm partial to the bunnies myself).

What I think is the saving grace of our living situation is my 10x16 shed that I've converted into my studio, so most of my day is spent in the shed and my husband works in the trailer.

A vast majority of people have told us they could not do what we do, which I completely understand. We just personally enjoy closer proximity to nature and feeling less attached to personal belongings. Additionally, when we think back to our time in a normal sized house, we spent most of our time together in our office which was a 10x12 room, and my studio was a 12x14 room, so not much has changed other than not having closets full to the brim with random junk.

The only thing I miss is having a decently sized bathroom/shower.


 
pollinator
Posts: 773
Location: Western MA, zone 6b
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Well,  the pandemic personally didn't change my life/lifestyle very much at all.   I'm single with grown children, and live alone with 2 big dogs and an indoor cat.  So there really wasn't suddenly extra people all at home at the same time.  I'm self employed and my work time didn't really change either.  

My current single-family home is 675sqft.   I don't use the second bedroom,not even for storage, I just don't have enough stuff to "need" it.   So that takes me down to about 550 sqft that I live in,  and includes kitchen, bath, laundry areas.    No basement or attic.   It never feels crowded or tight in that space,  I'm fairly minimal with how much "stuff" I own and keep.  My furniture is scaled to fit.  Plenty of open and walk through space.  
Psychologically I NEED open space, uncluttered surfaces, and not to feel boxed in.   That's been easy to achieve in 550.   I often speculate how much more of that 550  could I shave off and not miss it one bit?  I still have unused closet and cabinet space.   Pretty sure I could go down to 400,  or 350 without feeling much sacrifice.    Less than that?  Probably not while still having the indoor animals that I live/share space with.  But maybe.   While I spend a LOT of time outdoors,  I'm pretty heat/cold sensitive (RA, Fibromyalgia) so I need to consider indoor space during the hottest/coldest times.  But then moving to a more hospitable climate could solve some of that.  

Now I'm not sure what I'd do without my garden/tool shed;  that outdoor storage is essential for yard/ garden/ vehicle tools and maintenance, and outdoor animal supplies, etc.   That floorspace is another 200sqft. of storage.
 
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We love our school bus turned tiny home! As 50 something empty nesters, we dreamed, planned and built our Skoolie together almost 5 years ago. We are in our 4th year of full timing, staying stationary except for a location change up every year or two. With jobs and family nearby, and young grandchildren, we are saving travel for later. Our bus is an older model International- ‘93, and minus all the technical garb of modern vehicles, its easy to work on and parts aren’t too hard to find. We love our little home and have everything we need, and not a thing that we don’t. Some days I miss my art studio space but that’s a goal for the near future and I make due with smaller projects and different interests for now. We are in SE PA and have made a garden and flower beds wherever we land, also taking our flock of chickens with us (yes they have a separate coop)
Tiny Homesteading is pretty sweet and we look forward to our own little piece of land someday so we can stay and put down roots and call it all our own.
We are always on the lookout for similar minded friends to share with, (we alsodo work-shares in exchange for parking, or just pay rent) If you’re near us (Lancaster/Berks county PA and want to chat, please get in touch!
 
gardener
Posts: 1050
Location: Zone 6 in the Pacific Northwest
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This is a very interesting topic. Our current (and most likely forever) home is 1700 sf living space, not including the garage and a 700 sf nother-in-law apartment. We have a family of 7;) parents and kids) and we have extended family living in the apartment, for a total of 9 people on our 3.5 acres..

It is really too big but at the time we bought it, it was what we could afford, funnily enough. Smaller houses on similar land in the area were more expensive and often in fixer upper condition. Our house was newer built and in great condition. My husband and I are probably the only people who looked at it and thought it was too big. I actually have a friend who had moved here the same time we did and they had looked at it and decided it was too small for their family of six.

I have lived in small apartments and small houses, as small as 400sf. I never felt cramped. But I've visited people with horribly planned spaces and immediately felt claustrophobic. For us with all our kids, we could be very comfortable with plenty of space in 1200 sf in a traditional house.

I like to dabble in architecture and once planned out just how small I (personally) could go, imagining two parents and six kids. I came up with a design of 800sf, planning even for how much space I would need to pull out a dining chair and still have space to walk behind it and that kind of thing. But it had 10-12' ceilings. I think higher ceilings make a huge difference. Also if I had no outdoor space, that would make smaller living much harder.
 
pollinator
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Jenny - My current home is 1600sf and it is too large for me and my adult kid who is living here. It's also horribly set up. My house in the SF Bay Area was 1650sf and had 4 bedrooms, 2 bath and a family room. My family of 6 lived comfortably in that. This house when I moved in had one bedroom. We have since added a second bedroom.
And I think that's the main problem with larger houses, poorly utilized space.
I wanted to build my own small strawbale house, but building additional houses is problematic in Oregon.
The reason I like small or tiny houses is that we can all have our own. We functioned fine in our Bay Area house because know how to leave each other alone, not everyone is skilled at this or has any experience with this.
Our plan is to build detached bedrooms/tiny spaces for individuals. And then have community spaces, like an outdoor kitchen and sharing the larger houses common rooms.
 
Posts: 80
Location: Marbletown, NY
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Natural light, high ceilings and large windows make all the difference.  Reduce any of those 3 things, the more house I need, psychologically.  

Maximize them and you can get by with WAY less square footage as long as each person has their own private space to go to when they want.

1200 Square feet with 4 adults felt plenty large enough for us with double height ceilings, lots of light, and lots of openings to the outside views.  Now that we are just 2 living in the same house, it feels too big.

We also have a 2 room, 200 square foot low ceiling cabin that I prefer to go to on my own.  It feels too cluttered to be comfortable with 2 adults and a dog plus "stuff", even though we are smaller sized people with a medium size dog.

I watched a few videos on dome homes and the owners seem to agree that not having any corners, just continuous walls, this also seems to make a space more livable with less square footage even though harder to furnish.

So, I think it's more about how the space is designed and less about the actual square footage.



 
pollinator
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I've lived all of my adult life in very small spaces--commercial fishing boats, cabins, and trailers. I raised three boys in a 15x20 foot cabin. I think Americans mostly substitute physical space for psychological space. People from other countries often notice how "in your face" Americans are--we don't grow up with the same traditional  ways of giving people personal space. Learning to be quiet and not engage everyone in your vicinity is one strategy that makes small spaces larger. On boats and ships, it is an essential skill.

When Lloyd Kahn started writing about tiny homes he was talking about smaller, less wasteful spaces than the ridiculously large suburban home, more like what the majority of humankind has lived in over centuries, until very recently. Builders started making and selling units on trailer bodies that were easy to transport, and they kind of took over the tiny home idea. They can be simple, pleasant accommodation, if you don't have much stuff. But stuff isn't all bad and it isn't all consumer crap--libraries, tools, sewing supplies, food preservation equipment all take space. I have missed out on a lot of projects like sewing, leatherwork, painting, etc because the only thing there is room to do in my trailer is get in bed and read a book.

There is a reason that farmhouses have traditionally been good-sized. They have supported large, busy households, and were not just bedrooms but economic centers. I find that the very small tiny home is usually most comfortable for urban folks who have coffee shops and gyms and neighborhoods available as part of their larger infrastructure. Here in the country a family needs a lot of tools, and space to store them. My canning equipment alone would fill a tiny home. And since I live in something even smaller than a tiny home--a 16' travel trailer from the 1970s that I rescued from the dump--my tools and canning jars and projects have to live outdoors or in a tent nearby. They get mice pooping in them, they get dirty, they are hard to access. It's a pain. I would LOVE a larger place. But larger is relative; 1000 sq ft would be huge to me.

Funny how things get fancy names when the middle class adopts them.  What is now a tiny home used to just be a simple shack. And I see that localities are now zoning tiny homes (same size as a trailer but custom built and costing many times as much) as residential while forbidding trailers, which are economical and efficient housing whether you like the aesthetics or not. An ugly instance of class prejudice in action.
 
pollinator
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Children are happiest in a tiny hut where mom and dad are always close by. Only teenagers want a space of their own.
My boys even at the age 11 and 9 dragged their beds to one room and desks to another. They said it is so much nicer to be together!
So much for offering them an expensive big home 🙄

Now I live alone on my farm. The house is 200 sq feet and just perfect! I have a cosy bedroom and a living room cum kitchen. It is off grid, so heated with a wood stove. It warms quickly and requires very little wood. Oil lamps are just so cosy.

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Speaking for myself and probably going against what might be popular at this point in time, I think tiny houses are absurd. The last time I too a look, I noticed that I was not a sardine and have no intentions of living as though I were. I apologize if my opinion offends anyone, but there it is.
 
gardener
Posts: 693
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Thank you Kaarina for sharing your these inspiring photos of your enchanting home.
Many topics on permies open my mind, activate my sense of curiosity and expand my thinking. I have learned so much about minimalism, shedding clutter, and organizing my life through the tiny house movement.  My favorite vacations are in tiny homes situated on vast natural landscapes: oceans, lakes, cliffs, forests, mountains, sky and stars. I am really grateful for the expansive thinking that goes into creating a tiny home.
 
Jamie Chevalier
pollinator
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Kaarina Kreus wrote:Children are happiest in a tiny hut where mom and dad are always close by. Only teenagers want a space of their own.
My boys even at the age 11 and 9 dragged their beds to one room and desks to another. They said it is so much nicer to be together!
So much for offering them an expensive big home 🙄

Now I live alone on my farm. The house is 200 sq feet and just perfect! I have a cosy bedroom and a living room cum kitchen. It is off grid, so heated with a wood stove. It warms quickly and requires very little wood. Oil lamps are just so cosy.



This looks very much like the cabin I raised my kids in. They have fond memories of reading stories together by lamplight, and being part of the forest. Note that the photo shows one essential item often missing from the tiny home videos--a kitchen table, with places to sit and work quietly or share a meal. So many of the tiny home designs have couches and TV's but no place to come together around a table. A little shelf or counter where everyone faces the same way is not the same.
And so right about teens. Here in the California hills, many families with small cabins let their teens build a separate cabin, or they move in an old bus or van for them to have a space of their own to sleep and work in.
 
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My wife and I are empty nesters now, we went from 2000+ sq. ft. home on 33ac to a 1200 sq. ft. home city, and now 275 sq. ft. on 20ac. So the tiny home life is different. We love it, but would like to add on for overnight company.
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Kaarina Kreus
pollinator
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So true Jamie the Chevalier ❀
A kitchen table is the center of the family. You gather there for meals and long discussions. You do your paperwork there, kids do their homework. I always try to make doing homework a treat, cocoa, snacks, being together, helping each other out... Homework can be a feast, if you make it into one.

I remember a nanny wondering that my child loved his nappie change since most kids hate it. I said of course he loves it, every time I change his nappy I shower him with  kisses and sing to him, tickle him and giggle together with him.
 
Kaarina Kreus
pollinator
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My 200 square feet has 45 feet of shelf space in the foyer.
It is actually more than I need. I keep all stainless steel appliances like the honey spinner, juicemaker, cider press etc in a shed.
I have huge amounts of staples like pasta, dried peas, passata and jams here. Shelves on both sides of the foyer.
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Posts: 11
Location: Norway
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We moved into our house almost two years ago. A house that needs a little makeover. Our house is not really a tiny house, but it is not very big either. It has several small rooms and I find it difficult to furnish them. Where to put everything? I guess this is all about psychology. Being used to a totally different space with a big living room containing all the stuff (some of it crap) you get used to, and then, suddenly things change. But, I do believe it all has to do with getting used to it. It is difficult to throw away things that you love and think that you need. I guess I can get some inspiration from tiny house owners, and transfer it to my tiny rooms.
 
steward
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Hi, Hege

I feel that this is all about organization.

My suggestion would be to find a place for those things that you love.  Maybe they could be part of the decor, like on display.

Then think of parting with things that don't seem to have a place.

Make three boxes labeled keep, give away and store.

Start filling those boxes and the distrubuting accordingly.

This thread reminded me of my story about the Fly Lady:

https://permies.com/t/99222/permaculture-home-care-cleaning/purity/Decluttering-Minimalism#819119

http://www.flylady.net/d/getting-started/

You might also enjoy this thread:

https://permies.com/t/23053/permaculture-projects/Permaculture-Design-home
 
Hege Fossum
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I guess you're right... Organization...

Well, there are so many things I don't want to part with. I don't think I am collecting all kinds of stuff, but I love history, and furniture after my grandparents (on both sides) is something that I can't give away or throw away. Or old kitchen tools that no one knows what is any longer and, and, and... Well, you are right, I can't get rid of things, although I threw away a whole bedroom when we moved in here, and I regret. We were thinking of rebuilding the entire house because of this, but now I believe it will be wiser to just change my perspective.

One of my challenges is the living room. A small room with windows taking up one wall, the fireplace another and the third wall has a door. Where to put the tv and sofa? Haha. I must admit that I struggle.

I've heard of FlyLady before and will check it out. Decluttering is probably the way to go, or at least a part of the way, a nice place to start.
Thanks for the links.
 
Heather Staas
pollinator
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Use of space makes such a difference,  as does color and such.   Just to continue the psychology and perception aspect,  here are "before" and "after" photos of my living room/dining room space.   This area is 16x12 and makes up the main living space.   The "before" picture was the open house before I bought it;  painted a darker brownish and filled with oversized furniture.    Nothing WRONG with liking it to feel full, warm, and cozy.   But changing the color and the scale can make it feel lighter and more open if you have a need for space.  


After picture is downsized furniture and painted white, how I live in it now:  

after.jpg
[Thumbnail for after.jpg]
before.jpg
[Thumbnail for before.jpg]
 
Hege Fossum
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Thanks for sharing the pictures. I liked how you stripped down the interior so that the room looked bigger.

I think that choosing other furniture than I normally would have done will solve much, and using the corners was also a good idea. The right kind of furniture can go under the windows and what floor one chooses also has a lot to say, I think.
 
pollinator
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Reading this thread with interest. I notice that there are few voices of people who tried small living and decided it just wasn’t for them; I’m sure there are people in that camp, but they don’t seem to be posting in this thread.

We are currently in the process of decluttering and downsizing our “stuff”. Over the next 18 months, we will be selling our house.  We’ll then move  into our 28-foot travel trailer for a few months while building a new house on my in-law’s land. Our intention is to be close enough to their house to be able to support their aging in place (they’re both over 75 and my mother-in-law has some health concerns), but not right in their house so that they still feel independent. I’ll admit I’m not really looking forward to living in the trailer with our two big dogs and cat. I have a lot of pondering to do about what we will need to have at hand in the trailer to support my remote work (I’m in tech), help us establish the new homesite with grow space and critter space, and my usual food preservation activities.

Question for those who downsized—what was the hardest aspect for you, and what strategies did you take to resolve or improve it?
 
Heather Staas
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Honestly the hardest aspect was what to DO with extra stuff, and the effort and labor involved with moving it all.   Once it was gone,  I really felt free and unencumbered.   If I start feeling crowded or cramped for space,  getting rid of accumulation is always the answer for me personally.   Do I NEED another storage basket?  Do I NEED that extra chair?  Why do I have a BOX of stuff in this room.   Is there closet space holding things that no longer "pay rent" that should move along?    Is there storage that isn't working optimally for me?  

It's also freeing and liberating for me to ONLY own things that I can move myself.  No huge furniture pieces that require more labor than I can do myself.   Super tiny AC units that I can clean and store without help.  
 
Two tiny ads walk into a bar. The bartender says:
rocket mass heater risers: materials and design eBook
https://permies.com/w/risers-ebook
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