Ash Jackson

gardener
+ Follow
since Oct 03, 2017
Ash likes ...
hugelkultur kids forest garden books wofati cooking bike rocket stoves
Hello there!
I've long felt the 'call to cultivate'. I found Paul and his stuff in 2017, and have been steadily watching and learning since.
I went to part of the 2019 PEP Jamboree at Wheaton Labs! Simply put, it was awesome.
I feel pretty un-knowledgable about a lot (all?) of this stuff, but I'm really excited to learn, and learn, and learn.
I am really into PEP; partly as a result of that, and also because PEP is awesome, too.
My big-wild-crazy-scary-to-say-out-loud dream is to build a town with no cars that can feed itself.
I'm a Pod People. Podcast Progress: 360/4NN
Denver, 6a / BSk, rental house dweller, going back to Wheaton Labs soon
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Recent posts by Ash Jackson

"What would get YOU to do a BB?" / "How to get people doing the Permaculture Experience?"

Hi, I'm Ash. I'm trying to find more answers to this question. I think the answers will be as plural and varied as people are.

I'd like to learn what will get you doing BB's.


Brainstorm Ideas & stuff tried
600  The presentation of the information
 601  Forum-format poses a knowledge barrier for some; hard to learn a thing if one doesn't know it's there
   601.1 Libraries have librarians.
610  Make the information more visible on permies (i.e. more visual / url / digital on-ramps)
611  Square images on top/side banners at permies
  611.1   SKIP
     611.11  Straight to the SkIP Forum: https://permies.com/f/383/skip
     611.12  Straight to the PEP Forum: https://permies.com/f/178/ (my preference, since that's where BB's happen)
  611.2   Specific BB - (e.g. "The Skills to Inherit Property begin with... Sweeping the Floor!")
  611.3   Specific Badge - (e.g. Cat pawing ball of yarn goes to Textiles)
  611.4   What is SKIP? - A bright-shiny "this is SkIP and BB's" type page. The Homepage of SkIP, as it were.  Could Include:
     611.41  22 Aspects Page: https://permies.com/wiki/pep
     611.42  What is PEP/PEX: https://permies.com/t/96687/skills-inherit-property/PEP-PEX
     611.43  How long should PEP1 take: https://permies.com/t/84112/PEP-weeks-PEP-months-PEP
     611.44  The SkIP Page: https://permies.com/t/125806/skills-inherit-property/SkIP-develop-Skills-Inherit-Property
     611.45  ?? What other information is needed to get someone from Level 0 to Level 1 in SkIP / PEP / BB knowledge
  611.5   BB Club
     611.51  Example: PEP Planner Group: https://permies.com/t/137604/started-PEP-Weekly-PEP-Sprint
     611.52  Whatever the next iterations of this look like, hopefully there's more than one at a time someday
 612  Cross-post PEP threads to related topical subforums (e.g. Food Prep Badge to Food Prep)
 613  Make Badges for people (already done)
 614  ?? Other ways to make info more visible on permies? ??

620  Make the information more digestible (i.e. more mental on-ramps)
 621  Re-frame or re-describe PEP
   621.1  Say SKIP instead of PEP?
   621.2  Rewrite "What is SKIP?" Thread?
   621.3  Pose SKIP as "structured re-skilling?"
   621.4  "Do you have a skill you want to show off?"
 622  "there's a BB for that"
   622.1  Some people more likely do to the BB if they know it even exists
   622.2 Help people gain system knowledge
     622.21 How?
 623  a PEP badge tracker
 624  An app
 625  ?? Other ways to make the information more digestible? ??

630  Make it social: seeing other people doing BB's as encouragement (i.e. social on-ramps and social hooks)
 631  Game-ify Badges more
 632  PEP glory page on permies - hi-score page (social hook)
 633  Hi-score thread
 634  Public top-banner recognition of people achieving Badge-hood?
 635  ?? Other ways to make the activity social? ??

640  Make the information more visible on other websites
 641  SKIP bit.ly?
 642  ??
650  Make the information visible in other formats
 651  PEP book
 652  PEP podcasts
 653  ?? Other ways to make the information visible on other websites? ??

660  Get lots of people talking about it and excited about it
 661  The "Otis" "carrot"
 662  ?? Other ways to get people excited about it? ??

670  ?? Other ways to re-present the information? ??


700 Working on BB's in groups
 701  bb buddy helps with the social aspects
 702  helps people feel connected
 703  helps bring people back
 704  helps people feel validated for their BB
 705  helps people feel excited about...stirfry (for example)

710  working on BB's in groups: In-person
 711  PEP Jamboree (WL)
   711.1 Takeaways? (I mean, I had fun)
 712  regional local skills meetup, "for these things, we'll be doing these according to the rules of PEP. You don't have to, but I and a couple of others are doing this. It's basically the same, but we'll just be taking pictures also."
 713  ?? Other ways to work on BB's in an in-person group? ??

720  Working on BB's in groups: On-forum

 721  Monthly PEP Planner - Made a planner, with 1 BB each day for a month.
   721.2  BB's picked were themed by day of the week; (e.g. Monday was cooking day)
   721.3  Some work to make planner,
   721.4  A BB a day is likely too much for many people
   721.5  Strong virtual PEP group resulted, and persisted for about 6 weeks
   721.6  But how much of that was due to the PEP planner?

 722  Weekly PEP Sprints - Picked 2 BB's each week
   722.1  One slot was reserved to take someone through a full badge
   722.2  The other slot was for novelty, or to make it easy to join in anew
   722.3  Less work to create individual segments
   722.4  Didn't seem to get people as excited in the same way
   722.5  BB's chosen happened to be ones the prior group had already done, precluding them from participating
   722.6  A BB a week is likely right for many people

 723  BB club - BB of the week / SKIP club,
   723.1  possibly many more, shorter threads
     723.11  big long thread can sometimes be a deterrent to people joining in
   723.3  include a super easy BB every week (system knowledge on-ramp)
   723.4  nominate someone else to follow after you?

730  working on BB's in groups: Live Digital-in-person weekly zoom call -
 731  Format idea 1: 3 BB's for a week
   731.1  last week's 3 bb's
   731.2  what needs to happen for this week's 3 bb's
   731.3  include a super easy BB

 732 working on BB's in groups: Live Digital-in-person weekly zoom call - Format idea 2: just one BB per week
   732.1  work on a single badge as a cohort
   732.2  e.g. bodger club
   732.3  initial join-ees of the BB club get freebies (hook)
   732.4  if people attend at least 3 of the zooms, they get freebies

 733  ?? Other ways to work on BB's in online groups? ??

740 ?? Other ways to work on BB's in groups? ??

800 Working on BB's alone, posting results / progress
 801  This is the native setup of the current system (post in BB threads)
810 Individual posting to individual's specific BB thread
 811  https://permies.com/t/123420/PEP-Badge-Adventure
   811.1  Thread created small attention for the videos themselves. I'm unaware of any other people pursuing BB's because of the videos, though.
 812  ?? Other ways to work on BB's alone, but still sharing it? ??

900 Change the information
910  Change the information to be more broadly applicable
 911  PEX
 912  PEA
 913  PEfumt
 914  ??  Your version of PEX? ??
920  Change the information to be easier to do
930  Change the information to be less stringent

1000  ?? Other ways to get people doing BB's? ??

...

...

My understanding with the numbering is; if you have an opinion on #612, then you reference that so a dozen parallel conversations can occur in the forum format.

I've made this a wiki page just to facilitate my easy-editing long-term, not because I'm saying what's here is official in any way. If that was the wrong choice, just let me know.
Upon encouragement, I've cross-posted this to forms related to several of the PEP Aspects. If that was the wrong choice, just let me know.
Gently prodding the boundaries of this one a bit:

What if it's assembling an unassembled bike out of a box?

It's not the scrounging part, of the freecycles, nor is it the free-community-bike part, but I'm guessing it's mostly all the same tools and tool-work.
7 hours ago

Kenneth Elwell wrote:How about a smartphone APP?
Just take pictures or videos of your BBs from in the app, and then they are already logged in the right place. The whole skill tree could be searchable, and prompt steps for documenting the BBs, record/show your progress...



Hey Kenneth, have you ever used Trello? I find it's a bit like an app that you can make without programming.

If I knew Ruby, I'd've already tried this one. Then again, if I knew Ruby I'd be doing all sorts of other, stuff, too.
Cross-posting is a really good call, Eric. Thanks for reminding me of that. New #612.

I always get hung up on the "where," and feeling like I'm being spammy sending PEP out to other parts of permies.
Thank you, both for your input.

Kena, I can relate. Trying to track 10 gallons of my ruth stout composting 6 cups at a time has proven a logistical challenge.
I just realized another way to look at PEX is that an individual PEX is a "localization" of PEP.

Like when someone translates a book from one language to another.  My understanding is that often in that scenario; the folks best suited to do the work are the locals; they know the local conditions best and how things do or don't apply to their locale, to create an effective "localization."

From this, I realized other PEX's could be mapped to biomes instead of to the author's name; PESubTropics or PEOz or PEScan, in the way that PEApartment already is.
Thank you all, for your input.

Eric, is this thread (https://permies.com/t/123420/PEP-Badge-Adventure) what you envisioned when you describe one person posting their BB activity? Is it creating the engagement you're describing? Does it spur you to jump in and do a BB? (apparently I did post my earlier post after all...)


Sonja, would a PDF list of all the BB's help with the data-issue? I pay by-the-meg for my phone data, so I definitely get where you're coming from.


Skandi/Michael, would a PDF list of all the BB's make it easier to scan and digest the information?  All of PEP was a big, daunting wall of information for me, too, at first.
I give these videos 9 out of 10 acorns.

These videos brought together into one package lots of disparate "Sepp knowledge" I'd heard Paul talk about in his podcasts and articles (and probably elsewhere), but never heard all at once nor seen all the accompanying visuals.

Having all of that information right in one place, with the images of the Krameterhof, helps drive the points of wisdom home.

I use these videos when I want somebody to get closer to understanding the kind of cultivation I'm pursuing. It's beautiful, it's Sepp, and it's also distinctly not the home & garden magazine.

I wish there was more of them, or more info, or more detail. But that's the nature of an introductory program. I have these on DVD, so I can't speak to the streaming component of this, just the content. But my version was clearly lovingly-artisinally-hand-etched from the original VHS tapes.
2 days ago
Thank you all, for your input.

Eric: Does this thread (https://permies.com/t/123420/PEP-Badge-Adventure) do the engagement piece you're describing? Would it have encouraged you to jump in and do a BB yourself?
"What would get YOU to do a BB?" / "How to get people doing the Permaculture Experience?"

Hi, I'm Ash. I'm trying to find more answers to this question. I think the answers will be as plural and varied as people are.

I'd like to learn what will get you doing BB's.


Brainstorm Ideas & stuff tried
600  The presentation of the information
 601  Forum-format poses a knowledge barrier for some; hard to learn a thing if one doesn't know it's there
   601.1 Libraries have librarians.
610  Make the information more visible on permies (i.e. more visual / url / digital on-ramps)
611  Square images on top/side banners at permies
  611.1   SKIP
     611.11  Straight to the SkIP Forum: https://permies.com/f/383/skip
     611.12  Straight to the PEP Forum: https://permies.com/f/178/ (my preference, since that's where BB's happen)
  611.2   Specific BB - (e.g. "The Skills to Inherit Property begin with... Sweeping the Floor!")
  611.3   Specific Badge - (e.g. Cat pawing ball of yarn goes to Textiles)
  611.4   What is SKIP? - A bright-shiny "this is SkIP and BB's" type page. The Homepage of SkIP, as it were.  Could Include:
     611.41  22 Aspects Page: https://permies.com/wiki/pep
     611.42  What is PEP/PEX: https://permies.com/t/96687/skills-inherit-property/PEP-PEX
     611.43  How long should PEP1 take: https://permies.com/t/84112/PEP-weeks-PEP-months-PEP
     611.44  The SkIP Page: https://permies.com/t/125806/skills-inherit-property/SkIP-develop-Skills-Inherit-Property
     611.45  ?? What other information is needed to get someone from Level 0 to Level 1 in SkIP / PEP / BB knowledge
  611.5   BB Club
     611.51  Example: PEP Planner Group: https://permies.com/t/137604/started-PEP-Weekly-PEP-Sprint
     611.52  Whatever the next iterations of this look like, hopefully there's more than one at a time someday
 612  Cross-post PEP threads to related topical subforums (e.g. Food Prep Badge to Food Prep)
 613  Make Badges for people (already done)
 614  ?? Other ways to make info more visible on permies? ??

620  Make the information more digestible (i.e. more mental on-ramps)
 621  Re-frame or re-describe PEP
   621.1  Say SKIP instead of PEP?
   621.2  Rewrite "What is SKIP?" Thread?
   621.3  Pose SKIP as "structured re-skilling?"
   621.4  "Do you have a skill you want to show off?"
 622  "there's a BB for that"
   622.1  Some people more likely do to the BB if they know it even exists
   622.2 Help people gain system knowledge
     622.21 How?
 623  a PEP badge tracker
 624  An app
 625  ?? Other ways to make the information more digestible? ??

630  Make it social: seeing other people doing BB's as encouragement (i.e. social on-ramps and social hooks)
 631  Game-ify Badges more
 632  PEP glory page on permies - hi-score page (social hook)
 633  Hi-score thread
 634  Public top-banner recognition of people achieving Badge-hood?
 635  ?? Other ways to make the activity social? ??

640  Make the information more visible on other websites
 641  SKIP bit.ly?
 642  ??
650  Make the information visible in other formats
 651  PEP book
 652  PEP podcasts
 653  ?? Other ways to make the information visible on other websites? ??

660  Get lots of people talking about it and excited about it
 661  The "Otis" "carrot"
 662  ?? Other ways to get people excited about it? ??

670  ?? Other ways to re-present the information? ??


700 Working on BB's in groups
 701  bb buddy helps with the social aspects
 702  helps people feel connected
 703  helps bring people back
 704  helps people feel validated for their BB
 705  helps people feel excited about...stirfry (for example)

710  working on BB's in groups: In-person
 711  PEP Jamboree (WL)
   711.1 Takeaways? (I mean, I had fun)
 712  regional local skills meetup, "for these things, we'll be doing these according to the rules of PEP. You don't have to, but I and a couple of others are doing this. It's basically the same, but we'll just be taking pictures also."
 713  ?? Other ways to work on BB's in an in-person group? ??

720  Working on BB's in groups: On-forum

 721  Monthly PEP Planner - Made a planner, with 1 BB each day for a month.
   721.2  BB's picked were themed by day of the week; (e.g. Monday was cooking day)
   721.3  Some work to make planner,
   721.4  A BB a day is likely too much for many people
   721.5  Strong virtual PEP group resulted, and persisted for about 6 weeks
   721.6  But how much of that was due to the PEP planner?

 722  Weekly PEP Sprints - Picked 2 BB's each week
   722.1  One slot was reserved to take someone through a full badge
   722.2  The other slot was for novelty, or to make it easy to join in anew
   722.3  Less work to create individual segments
   722.4  Didn't seem to get people as excited in the same way
   722.5  BB's chosen happened to be ones the prior group had already done, precluding them from participating
   722.6  A BB a week is likely right for many people

 723  BB club - BB of the week / SKIP club,
   723.1  possibly many more, shorter threads
     723.11  big long thread can sometimes be a deterrent to people joining in
   723.3  include a super easy BB every week (system knowledge on-ramp)
   723.4  nominate someone else to follow after you?

730  working on BB's in groups: Live Digital-in-person weekly zoom call -
 731  Format idea 1: 3 BB's for a week
   731.1  last week's 3 bb's
   731.2  what needs to happen for this week's 3 bb's
   731.3  include a super easy BB

 732 working on BB's in groups: Live Digital-in-person weekly zoom call - Format idea 2: just one BB per week
   732.1  work on a single badge as a cohort
   732.2  e.g. bodger club
   732.3  initial join-ees of the BB club get freebies (hook)
   732.4  if people attend at least 3 of the zooms, they get freebies

 733  ?? Other ways to work on BB's in online groups? ??

740 ?? Other ways to work on BB's in groups? ??

800 Working on BB's alone, posting results / progress
 801  This is the native setup of the current system (post in BB threads)
810 Individual posting to individual's specific BB thread
 811  https://permies.com/t/123420/PEP-Badge-Adventure
   811.1  Thread created small attention for the videos themselves. I'm unaware of any other people pursuing BB's because of the videos, though.
 812  ?? Other ways to work on BB's alone, but still sharing it? ??

900 Change the information
910  Change the information to be more broadly applicable
 911  PEX
 912  PEA
 913  PEfumt
 914  ??  Your version of PEX? ??
920  Change the information to be easier to do
930  Change the information to be less stringent

1000  ?? Other ways to get people doing BB's? ??

...

...

My understanding with the numbering is; if you have an opinion on #612, then you reference that so a dozen parallel conversations can occur in the forum format.

I've made this a wiki page just to facilitate my easy-editing long-term, not because I'm saying what's here is official in any way. If that was the wrong choice, just let me know.
Upon encouragement, I've cross-posted this to forms related to several of the PEP Aspects. If that was the wrong choice, just let me know.