Phil Bannon

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since Dec 10, 2013
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Recent posts by Phil Bannon

Phil Bannon wrote:

Mac abees wrote:Ok here goes! I need to build an over shot water wheel, head does not matter, speed does not matter. All i need to figure out is how big, wide and deep a wheel I need to get at least 70 to 80 horse power at the shaft if some one can help me with that i can build a generator system anywhere. I will explain the rest after my patent lol. Eveyone one seems to be hooked on speed or rpms thats not what you need. The wheel should be at a snails pace but geared to spin a generator at 3600 rpm. Its right here in my head but to actually work it out in the real world i need help at this point the rest is easy. Im using just the pure natural weight of the water to turn the wheel.





5 Dia Wheel Wire spool
2.5 Radius
5 mph Stream
50 pounds of force on the wheel is not too un-imaginable


15.707963267948966192313216916398 circumference
Since 5280 feet = 1 mile
5280/15.707963267948966192313216916398=336.13523981008294914388250824274=

1680.6761990504147457194125412137 RPH
28.011269984173579095323542353562 RPM
5.6022539968347158190647084707123 RPM = a 5 foot Dia wheel needs to turn about 5 RPM to reach 1 mph
28.011269984173579095323542353562 RPM to reach 5 Mile an Hour
125 pounds of torque = 50 x 2.5R

70 to 6 teeth 1:11.666666666666666666666666666667 (Bicycle Cog to Lawn mower sprocket)

28.011269984173579095323542353562 x 11= 308.12396982590937004855896588918
308.12396982590937004855896588918 RPM (Too low RPM)

70 to 6 teeth 1:11.666666666666666666666666666667 (Bicycle Cog to Lawn mower sprocket) again
3389.363668085003070534148624781 RPM

5.6818181818181818181818181818182 Pounds of torque If Torque is some what Hp relative, then
5 hp Minus the deficiencies of the RPM multiplier(s)

About 4,000 Watts


However, 3600 RPM is not needed (For 60cps) if a Car Alternator is used
Suggest; 800 RPM Field dependent (Stator) Low RPM is more efficient and less Cost


Also consider;
Alternator uses a electro magnetic field which is voltage variable = variable wattage output
Generator uses a perm magnetic field which is not variable = Wattage output is RPM dependent
Smaller the Wheel is the faster it will turn
Power (or wattage) is developed by Torque
When generating AC Power the only thing to consider in RPM is Cycles per second.
To get 60 CPS Most small AC Generators require 1800rpm and Lighter portables are 3600rpm



To get 80 hp my figures can be extrapolated





Ok, Guys, Sooooooooooo, I have a question;

Consider my above example; as a undershot five foot diameter Wheel, Dipped in a flow of water,
1 foot deep on center, one foot wide paddle and a five mile an hour flow of water.

Problem: With the exception, of load; Torque is not a constant.

Agreed we can improve efficiency, curve the buckets, Large diameter Low speed generator...

What would be the output (Wattage/Torque/Horse) Power for water speed of five Miles an hour flow?


7 years ago

Phil Bannon wrote:

Mac abees wrote:Ok here goes! I need to build an over shot water wheel, head does not matter, speed does not matter. All i need to figure out is how big, wide and deep a wheel I need to get at least 70 to 80 horse power at the shaft if some one can help me with that i can build a generator system anywhere. I will explain the rest after my patent lol. Eveyone one seems to be hooked on speed or rpms thats not what you need. The wheel should be at a snails pace but geared to spin a generator at 3600 rpm. Its right here in my head but to actually work it out in the real world i need help at this point the rest is easy. Im using just the pure natural weight of the water to turn the wheel.





5 Dia Wheel Wire spool
2.5 Radius
5 mph Stream
50 pounds of force on the wheel is not too un-imaginable


15.707963267948966192313216916398 circumference
Since 5280 feet = 1 mile
5280/15.707963267948966192313216916398=336.13523981008294914388250824274=

1680.6761990504147457194125412137 RPH
28.011269984173579095323542353562 RPM
5.6022539968347158190647084707123 RPM = a 5 foot Dia wheel needs to turn about 5 RPM to reach 1 mph
28.011269984173579095323542353562 RPM to reach 5 Mile an Hour
125 pounds of torque = 50 x 2.5R

70 to 6 teeth 1:11.666666666666666666666666666667 (Bicycle Cog to Lawn mower sprocket)

28.011269984173579095323542353562 x 11= 308.12396982590937004855896588918
308.12396982590937004855896588918 RPM (Too low RPM)

70 to 6 teeth 1:11.666666666666666666666666666667 (Bicycle Cog to Lawn mower sprocket) again
3389.363668085003070534148624781 RPM

5.6818181818181818181818181818182 Pounds of torque If Torque is some what Hp relative, then
5 hp Minus the deficiencies of the RPM multiplier(s)

About 4,000 Watts


However, 3600 RPM is not needed (For 60cps) if a Car Alternator is used
Suggest; 800 RPM Field dependent (Stator) Low RPM is more efficient and less Cost


Also consider;
Alternator uses a electro magnetic field which is voltage variable = variable wattage output
Generator uses a perm magnetic field which is not variable = Wattage output is RPM dependent
Smaller the Wheel is the faster it will turn
Power (or wattage) is developed by Torque
When generating AC Power the only thing to consider in RPM is Cycles per second.
To get 60 CPS Most small AC Generators require 1800rpm and Lighter portables are 3600rpm



To get 80 hp my figures can be extrapolated





Ok, Guys, Sooooooooooo, I have a question;

Consider my above example; as a undershot five foot diameter Wheel, Dipped in a flow of water,
1 foot deep one center, one foot wide paddle and a five mile an hour flow of water.

Problem: With the exception, of load; Torque is not a constant.

Agreed we can improve efficiency, curve the buckets, Large diameter Low speed generator...

What would be the output (Wattage/Torque/Horse) Power for water speed of five Miles an hour flow?


7 years ago

Mac abees wrote:Ok here goes! I need to build an over shot water wheel, head does not matter, speed does not matter. All i need to figure out is how big, wide and deep a wheel I need to get at least 70 to 80 horse power at the shaft if some one can help me with that i can build a generator system anywhere. I will explain the rest after my patent lol. Eveyone one seems to be hooked on speed or rpms thats not what you need. The wheel should be at a snails pace but geared to spin a generator at 3600 rpm. Its right here in my head but to actually work it out in the real world i need help at this point the rest is easy. Im using just the pure natural weight of the water to turn the wheel.





5 Dia Wheel Wire spool
2.5 Radius
5 mph Stream
50 pounds of force on the wheel is not too un-imaginable


15.707963267948966192313216916398 circumference
Since 5280 feet = 1 mile
5280/15.707963267948966192313216916398=336.13523981008294914388250824274=

1680.6761990504147457194125412137 RPH
28.011269984173579095323542353562 RPM
5.6022539968347158190647084707123 RPM = a 5 foot Dia wheel needs to turn about 5 RPM to reach 1 mph
28.011269984173579095323542353562 RPM to reach 5 Mile an Hour
125 pounds of torque = 50 x 2.5R

70 to 6 teeth 1:11.666666666666666666666666666667 (Bicycle Cog to Lawn mower sprocket)

28.011269984173579095323542353562 x 11= 308.12396982590937004855896588918
308.12396982590937004855896588918 RPM (Too low RPM)

70 to 6 teeth 1:11.666666666666666666666666666667 (Bicycle Cog to Lawn mower sprocket) again
3389.363668085003070534148624781 RPM

5.6818181818181818181818181818182 Pounds of torque If Torque is some what Hp relative, then
5 hp Minus the deficiencies of the RPM multiplier(s)

About 4,000 Watts


However, 3600 RPM is not needed (For 60cps) if a Car Alternator is used
Suggest; 800 RPM Field dependent (Stator) Low RPM is more efficient and less Cost


Also consider;
Alternator uses a electro magnetic field which is voltage variable = variable wattage output
Generator uses a perm magnetic field which is not variable = Wattage output is RPM dependent
Smaller the Wheel is the faster it will turn
Power (or wattage) is developed by Torque
When generating AC Power the only thing to consider in RPM is Cycles per second.
To get 60 CPS Most small AC Generators require 1800rpm and Lighter portables are 3600rpm



To get 80 hp my figures can be extrapolated
7 years ago