replacing irrigation with permaculture

Jack Spirko does a podcast where he effectively interviews me, but I'm not there!  So much easier!   

Jack presents a lot of his own original thoughts on replacing irrigation with permaculture.  Very good stuff:

http://www.thesurvivalpodcast.com/permaculture-solutions-for-water-needs

Emerson White wrote:
As temperature falls the partial pressure of water falls, which causes the water in the air to be squeezed out onto cool surfaces, this is due. The more humidity you get into the air before the temperature falls the more you can get back out.

Dew is caused by the moisture in the ground, not the moisture in the air.  See the following URL for this quote "Experiments conducted in 1885 to determine the origin of the water found that dew forms not from dampness in the air but from moisture in the ground directly beneath the site of the condensation" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dew_pond

SILVERSEEDS wrote:
Remembered another one, im not sure was covered....

"dust" mulching. this is a tactic of real dry areas. because of how water evaporates, if the surface of the soil is wet, it will happen faster then if after it rains you put down  layer of dust if rains not expected. this might not be worthwhile in the middle of monsoon season for instance. Or maybe it is...

But Ive found it rather effective in my trials. surprisingly so actually.

There's a hand tool call a roller scraper that you walk behind like a lawnmower. It looks very much like a push mower actually except that it has a horizontal blade on the bottom that is below the rolling portion so as you move it, it slices off the top vegetation, kills the capillary column which then stops the perspiring of the moisture from the land. Use this tool and you don't need to bring dust and lay on top, instead, just create it instantly!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaqIs-6Ay24

AZGuy wrote:I am experimenting with zero pressure irrigation to start growing trees/foliage and building the soil. I don't want to leave my well pump powered when I'm away, in case of leaks or vandalism that might cause it to run for weeks. 

I'm thinking of digging trenches and planting hardy southern trees in them, perhaps lucaena,  with ample mulch, and  hopefully some drip irrigation to help them along.

I'd appreciate other ideas

Groasis Waterboxx.  Two words for you.  I just came across this myself only a few days ago, but I'm ready to evangelize because it sure looks like it's quite a neat little device.  You have to order them from Holland. I just ordered my first box of 10.  There's another fellow on permies who has used them on his prairie property and he put a video on Youtube about it. I'm sure if you hunt around you will find a bunch of videos not from Groasis.  The CEO returns emails. I emailed him about gophers. He sent me back to his site where I got necessary valuable information that made me decide to spend $275 for 10 of those Waterboxxes.  I think it was Popular Science that last year awarded the Groasis Waterboxx the best invention of 2010.

With the Groasis Waterboxx, you don't need to irrigate!  And it replenishes its water supply from rain and condensation.  It protects the seedlings from the sun so they get good sun in morning/afternoon but not at noon when the sun could scorch them.  It mimics nature.  And it is hands off, you plant your seeds, come back in a year and they are trees.  It has a 100% success in some areas, and in the extreme desert it is I think 85% successful after removal of the Waterboxx after only one year.  From that point on the roots of the tree are in the ground water.  I can't think of enough good things to say about this and I haven't even used it yet!  It's legit, and you can join the study, when you buy you're encouraged to participate and provide your results so that others might benefit from the shared information.

Watch this video first!  http://www.youtube.com/user/Groasiswaterboxx#p/u/1/HRF2bUBPA90

Then here's the site URL: http://groasis.com/page/uk/index.php

Off The Grid wrote:
Groasis Waterboxx.  Two words for you. 

Yes, I've seem them and they look to be very effective. I find them to be a little expensive, but in the end, they might well be more economical than the screwing around I'm doing now with the small pool.  It actually is working, but requires refilling every 3 - 4 weeks.  I have some Morninga trees growing on my land in the SE Arizona desert.  I hope they can handle the cooler weather of the winter.  I also have had to protect them from Jack rabbits which are prevalent in the area.

Regards,
AZGuy

That Groasis waterboxx seems like an excellent solution to the dilemma of "Its too much dam work to water my trees every day!" Watering once a month compared to once a day in the desert climate, man, that would make it possible to grow like 50 or 100 times the amount of trees you want.

Definitely sounds good for large scale "Greening the Desert" type things. 

mrchuck wrote:
That Groasis waterboxx seems like an excellent solution to the dilemma of "Its too much dam work to water my trees every day!" Watering once a month compared to once a day in the desert climate, man, that would make it possible to grow like 50 or 100 times the amount of trees you want.

Definitely sounds good for large scale "Greening the Desert" type things.   

It's not that I'm lazy, it's just that I only make it out to my property about once a month. I've discovered you can grow damn near anything in the desert if you can water it enough. We have a lush 33' X 35' garden in Phoenix but we have to water every day. If I was living on the property full time I'd set up a good drip system, like I have in Phoenix.

AZGuy

Paul and Skeeter talk about keyline systems in this podcast: http://www.richsoil.com/permaculture/422-podcast-072-keyline-systems/

Paul's presentation on Replacing Irrigation with Permaculture at the Inland Northwest Permaculture Convergence: http://www.richsoil.com/permaculture/508-podcast-087-replacing-irrigation-with-permaculture/

I can't really say if the Sahara was created by cutting down trees or not, but it doesn't seem likely the reason for cutting down the trees would be to grow crops. The Sahara was formed about 5000BC and agriculture came much later, from Mesopotamia. Egypt trailed Mesopotamia by quite a while in agricultural and it was when the Nile was created by the formation of the Sahara that agriculture could really take off.

Paul and Jack Spirko talk about "lessons from the forest" in this podcast: podcast.

They talk about the relationship between trees and water (not needing to irrigate)

The Duke delivered the "Replacing Irrigation with Permaculture" presentation to a group of 80 people in north Idaho on January 23, 2017.  I filmed the event and have part 1 and 2 available for your viewing pleasure below.  Part 3 should be ready early next week.




And this one has a portion of my interview with the Duke in my vlog for the day:

Part 3 of the Duke's presentation is now available:

Paul will be giving a massively updated version of this famous presentation this Saturday January 21 at 10:00 am MT.  Come pester him:

      https://permies.com/w/198448/irrigation-webinar

paul wheaton wrote:Granted, there are scads of ideas of what permaculture is and what irrigation is.

For me, based on my knowledge set at this time, it is my arrogant and obnoxiuous opinion that a good permaculture system has eliminated irrigation.

Irrigation is gonna be buckets, hoses, tubes or pipes carrying water to one or more plants.  Permaculture is going to be working with nature to make sure that the plants get all the water they need using the same tools that nature uses.  So those plants will continue to thrive for years without depending on us to remember to water them.

Ok but that is after the system has established.
And granted, in temperate areas it’s highly likely no irrigation would ever be needed for trees and shrubs and maybe even annual gardens to establish.
But in summer or seasonally dry regions, unless only native plants are used and started when rains come, one needs to irrigate to establish.
Dry farming, and some of the techniques you mention above, aid in reducing irrigation also for annual gardens.
Annual gardens however, really do need at least a little irrigation water to work in Mediterranean areas, even with the best permaculture techniques.