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Is there some fatal flaw I have overseen?
daniel mielke wrote: When you say that the wood has a tendency to rot, wouldn't a pre-treat of some kind elevated this problem. Short of using creosote, would a borax, then linwood oil or some sort of organic pine tar to inhibit rot.
daniel mielke wrote:
If as I would like to do, using norway pine for strength, inclosing the entire log within a concrete foundation/basement wall, is there a treatment in the concrete that would encapsulate the timber to prohibit a rot situation? It seems to me when going through some cordwood classes (given by the Richard and Becky Flatau) that there are some kind of polymer additives to concrete that can seal/encapsulate or retard moisture.
When looking at Cob structures in these forums, England is a wet North Atlantic country most of the time and they have structures with timber that are hundreds of years old and sturdy as heck. Hope someone with some experience can help us out here. Have been perusing this site for three years now without ever signing up. This is my first post. Thanks beki for forcing me out of obscurity and into this world of PERMIES!!!
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in west virginia now in a small town martinsburg growing lots of veggies.. thank you Jesus
PS: always seeking followers of Jesus
I would be cautious of using white pine, it is a pretty soft wood that can go punky quite easily, just take a walk through a white pine forest. I would suggest investing in white cedar, which is available locally, much stronger and is more decay resistant. White Pine is not use for structural support. Your building inspector is not doing you any favors, it is not the right material for the use you are planning, use White Cedar instead and consult with the university extension service for selecting the proper materials.beki gamble wrote:So the home we are building will have post and beams made from white pine that has been cured and had the bark and cambium removed. We are planning on submerging them in a stone foundation resting on a concrete footing with gravel back fill. the beams will go all the way to the footing. We were planning on using creosote where the beam will be touching stone or cement, because we will not be able to access it to re-treat it. We are hoping this will prevent rotting. the house is on top of a well drained hill and will have a very large overhanging roof. We are in NH, where it can get wet, cold, dry and hot depending on the month. I know creosote is gross, but I dont know what will work better. The plans have been approved by a building inspector.
My question is Will this be enough to prevent rot? Is there some fatal flaw I have overseen? Any suggestions?
thanks everybody.
This is plainly not a true statement and must be corrected for the betterment of this forum's general information. I am a traditional timber wright, and can assure you that White Pine is not only a structural timber, it is one of the leading timber species used in vintage traditional timber frames, as well as, contemporary timber frames and log cabin architecture. That includes the posts, beams, and all structural timber elements, when done correctly.White Pine is not use for structural support...
Again, other than decay resistance, this comment is not accurate in any way. I will just list a Compression Parallel to the Grain Maximum Crushing Strength in psi, then provide a link for the others structural numbers. As you can see, White Pine is 840 psi stronger than White Cedar. Cedar in generally a very weak wood.white cedar, which is available locally, much stronger and is more decay resistant...
Jay C. White Cloud wrote:Hello N. McCoy,
I have some reservation about Beki Gamble's general plan, but with some "tweaking" it could work fine. I must point out some misinformation in your post.
This is plainly not a true statement and must be corrected for the betterment of this forum's general information. I am a traditional timber wright, and can assure you that White Pine is not only a structural timber, it is one of the leading timber species used in vintage traditional timber frames, as well as, contemporary timber frames and log cabin architecture. That includes the posts, beams, and all structural timber elements, when done correctly.White Pine is not use for structural support...
Again, other than decay resistance, this comment is not accurate in any way. I will just list a Compression Parallel to the Grain Maximum Crushing Strength in psi, then provide a link for the others structural numbers. As you can see, White Pine is 840 psi stronger than White Cedar. Cedar in generally a very weak wood.white cedar, which is available locally, much stronger and is more decay resistant...
Cedar, Northern White: 3,960
Pine, Eastern white: 4,800
http://www.woodworkweb.com/woodwork-topics/wood/146-wood-strengths.html
Jay C. White Cloud wrote:Hello Beki,
I live not far from you, over in Vermont. There aren't a lot of folks out there that try to build as natural as they can but there are a few of us. It is a lost life skill to build naturally, and many are forced to rely on more modern, and often misleading modalities of building. I stay as far away from concrete as I possible can. I don't care for the environmental foot print, and as a seasoned timber wright, I have seen more problems than good in 37 years of doing this kind of work. Don't miss understand me, I still use it in certain circumstances, but I do it with a keen eye to the applicable reason, and understand all it's short comings. I would have to see a visual description to give you my two cents worth on what you are planning, but there are a number of natural solution to preserving wood, even below grade, where you could expect to achieve 100 plus year lift span. Still not as good as above grade application with good drainage and architectural overhangs.
Jay C. White Cloud wrote:Your comments remind me that I really need to do a post taking folks through the "basics" of this process, so they can perhaps glean a little bit better understanding of how this system works.
"...In our language this quality is called dadirri. It is inner, deep listening and quiet, still awareness.
Dadirri recognises the deep spring that is inside us. We call on it and it calls to us. This is the gift that Australia is thirsting for...
When I experience dadirri, I am made whole again."
-Miriam - Rose Ungunmerr- Baumann
Glenn Herbert wrote:"How tall is the building, and how much floor area does each beam support?
Glenn Herbert wrote:Do you have any idea what kind of wood the original beams are? Softwood or hardwood? How is the structure above connected to the beams, and how will you support that to replace the beams?
Jay C. White Cloud wrote:Hello Beki,
I live not far from you, over in Vermont. There aren't a lot of folks out there that try to build as natural as they can but there are a few of us. It is a lost life skill to build naturally, and many are forced to rely on more modern, and often misleading modalities of building. I stay as far away from concrete as I possible can. I don't care for the environmental foot print, and as a seasoned timber wright, I have seen more problems than good in 37 years of doing this kind of work. Don't miss understand me, I still use it in certain circumstances, but I do it with a keen eye to the applicable reason, and understand all it's short comings. I would have to see a visual description to give you my two cents worth on what you are planning, but there are a number of natural solution to preserving wood, even below grade, where you could expect to achieve 100 plus year lift span. Still not as good as above grade application with good drainage and architectural overhangs.
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