• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
permaculture forums growies critters building homesteading energy monies kitchen purity ungarbage community wilderness fiber arts art permaculture artisans regional education skip experiences global resources cider press projects digital market permies.com pie forums private forums all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
master stewards:
  • Carla Burke
  • Nancy Reading
  • John F Dean
  • r ranson
  • Jay Angler
  • paul wheaton
stewards:
  • Pearl Sutton
  • Liv Smith
  • Anne Miller
master gardeners:
  • Timothy Norton
  • Christopher Weeks
gardeners:
  • Andrés Bernal
  • Jeremy VanGelder
  • Matt McSpadden

How do I keep my worms from escaping?

 
Posts: 2
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I just recently started a worm farm an am running into a problem with them escaping out of their bins. Does anyone know how to prevent this?
 
steward
Posts: 15399
Location: Northern WI (zone 4)
4784
7
hunting trees books food preservation solar woodworking
  • Likes 5
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Might they be trying to escape conditions that are sub-optimal?  How are you managing the bin, how wet is it, what materials are you adding, etc?  Maybe it's an easy fix...
 
Ryan Neusch
Posts: 2
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I’m using shredded paper and cut up cardboard as my substrate which always damp but not soaked. The walls of the container are always moist. I feed them food scraps from a local grocery store which contains mostly watermelon rines, cantaloupe rines, honeydew rines, pineapple peels, and occasionally lettuce and spinach leaves. I read that they needed a neutral ph so I’ve recently added lime (the soil additive not the citrus fruit) to their food.  
 
pollinator
Posts: 3654
Location: 4b
1320
dog forest garden trees bee building
  • Likes 3
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Mine always tried to escape when they were too wet.
 
gardener
Posts: 570
Location: Central Texas
239
hugelkultur forest garden trees rabbit greening the desert homestead
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Mine only climb the walls if the condensation builds up on the sides of the bin (and there's no other issues with the environment).

Try leaving the lid off the bin to discourage them. That will keep the sides dry and increase the light on the surface, which they don't like.
 
pollinator
Posts: 412
124
2
dog trees books bee medical herbs
  • Likes 4
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
As others have stated, worms trying to get out is because of a problem with the bin environment. They are trying not do die, so they go to look for a different place to live. Once you figure out what the problem is, you should also add spent coffee grounds to their bin; they love spent coffee grounds. That should help having them forgive you for your bin snafu. :-)
 
gardener
Posts: 1690
Location: N. California
778
2
hugelkultur kids cat dog fungi trees books chicken cooking medical herbs ungarbage
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I know lots of people use paper and cardboard for the base of there worm bin, but my thinking is I want the best worm-castings I can get, and I have my doubts about large amounts of paper and cardboard. (just me)  I started my bin not quite a year ago.  I used a combination of 1 year old wood chips, organic composted chicken manure, some soil, and coco coir.  Now it did take longer them a lot of people say to brake down, but I was super happy with the castings I got, and the worms never tried to escape.
My friend wants to try vermicomposting, so I thought I would see if I could start a little colony for her.  I pulled out 50+ worm put them in a small plastic tub with the stuff I fill my bin in.  I put a card board box on top.  I feed them kitchen scraps.  I didn't know if it would work, there are no holes in the bin, it isn't very big, and they could totally get out if they wanted to.  For some reason they are still there and I think they are increasing in number.  They are just waiting for my friend to set up her bin.
Even if you don't want to wait for wood chips, you might want to but something in with your paper and cardboard.  Its worth a shot.  Good luck to you.
 
Posts: 94
Location: Zone 9, CA
20
books urban
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Worms are often uncomfortable in a new bin. It's unfamiliar. New. And the food is different. Not like the comfy old bin. They go on walkabout to find "home".

First check to see that the bin is not heating up, there's air flow, and make sure the bedding is damp but not soggy. If all these things are OK, take any top off the bin, and turn a light on over the opening. Worms hate light, and they will stay in the bin. Keep a light on over the bin, even at night (especially at night) for a few weeks. After a while, they'll begin to believe that they are home, and stay put.
 
pollinator
Posts: 981
Location: New Brunswick, Canada
244
duck tiny house chicken composting toilet homestead
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I got worms again a few weeks ago and I split them into two bins as I knew I was going to split them anyway and this way they're only shocked once.  I used torn up cardboard and peat for bedding, added in some rabbit manure with some straw, put in coffee grounds and other food waste from work and let them go.  One bin was on top of the other with the bottom bin covered with a lid.  No holes in either bin.

After a week I opened the bottom bin to check.  They were covering the walls.  I think they were both hot and too humid.  I took the lid off, gently scraped them off the walls and put them on top with more bedding added.  I've since left the lid off and they're happy as worms in shit.  The wall climbing lets you know there's an issue, but you need to figure out which one.  
 
Timothy Markus
pollinator
Posts: 981
Location: New Brunswick, Canada
244
duck tiny house chicken composting toilet homestead
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Jen Fulkerson wrote:I know lots of people use paper and cardboard for the base of there worm bin, but my thinking is I want the best worm-castings I can get, and I have my doubts about large amounts of paper and cardboard. (just me)  I started my bin not quite a year ago.  I used a combination of 1 year old wood chips, organic composted chicken manure, some soil, and coco coir.  Now it did take longer them a lot of people say to brake down, but I was super happy with the castings I got, and the worms never tried to escape.
My friend wants to try vermicomposting, so I thought I would see if I could start a little colony for her.  I pulled out 50+ worm put them in a small plastic tub with the stuff I fill my bin in.  I put a card board box on top.  I feed them kitchen scraps.  I didn't know if it would work, there are no holes in the bin, it isn't very big, and they could totally get out if they wanted to.  For some reason they are still there and I think they are increasing in number.  They are just waiting for my friend to set up her bin.
Even if you don't want to wait for wood chips, you might want to but something in with your paper and cardboard.  Its worth a shot.  Good luck to you.



I understand your concerns, but I like cardboard, but not paper, as bedding.  I found paper far too likely to mat but cardboard isn't too bad if you fluff it up as you add it to the bin.  I've found that worms just LOVE cardboard both as a feed source, but also as a place to hang out.  I've found big pieces of corrugated that were full of worms when I peeled back the backing.  I've also used chicken and quail bedding.  My experience was that it took about 3 times longer to finish a bin than cardboard.  I didn't notice much difference in the final product but I found I had to be careful with the bird bedding as it could be too hot.  They were all fed the same quality foodstuffs and I think that may have more impact on final quality than bedding.  

I think you can use whatever you have and my preference is to mix up both the bedding and food sources as variety is the spice of life.  If people have the room and access to different bedding types, I'd suggest running two bins and seeing what happens.  I've got access to a boatload (it comes in on boats) of cardboard and I steal the green bin contents from the lunchroom.  I'm going to start a new bin every week or two, populating from the original two.  I've got a third bin on the go now and I'll start another in a week.  
 
Jen Fulkerson
gardener
Posts: 1690
Location: N. California
778
2
hugelkultur kids cat dog fungi trees books chicken cooking medical herbs ungarbage
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Timothy thanks for the info.  I am thinking about starting a second bin.  I don't know how you would know the quality of the worm castings unless you had them tested, which I won't be able to afford.  Thanks 😊
 
Timothy Markus
pollinator
Posts: 981
Location: New Brunswick, Canada
244
duck tiny house chicken composting toilet homestead
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Jen Fulkerson wrote:Timothy thanks for the info.  I am thinking about starting a second bin.  I don't know how you would know the quality of the worm castings unless you had them tested, which I won't be able to afford.  Thanks 😊



I think a second bin is good to have both to process/create more and also as insurance in case of issues in 1 bin.  I also find it helps to be able to alternate food additions between bins.  

As far as quality, I agree.  It just seemed to me that the finished product seemed very similar regardless of bedding.  Now I like to use as many different things as possible, both as food and as bedding.  I use mostly cardboard but I like some peat and aged manure or rabbit manure.  I layer it and provide two corners with just bedding all the way up.  I add some lime and some DE and try to get a variety of food too.  One nice thing about cardboard is that they can eat it pretty readily so it's a good option for leaving them alone for a while whereas I didn't find that with the shavings.
 
Jen Fulkerson
gardener
Posts: 1690
Location: N. California
778
2
hugelkultur kids cat dog fungi trees books chicken cooking medical herbs ungarbage
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I started my second bin with mostly cut up cardboard and paper.  I added a little compost.  It's been a couple of weeks.  I need to add more cardboard.  The bin seems dense, maybe this is ok, but it seems wrong to me.  Should I add something else to the bedding?  The worms are breaking down the bedding, and the food scraps I put in there it is damp not wet, doesn't smell.  Maybe it's fine just different then I'm use to.  Even though there "just worms" I'm responsible for them, and don't want to create a miserable living environment for them.  They are my little workers and I want them to be comfortable and happy little worms.
 
Ronnie Ugulano
Posts: 94
Location: Zone 9, CA
20
books urban
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
The bin seems dense, maybe this is ok, but it seems wrong to me.

When you say "dense", what does that mean? Compacted? Heavy (weight)?

I need to add more cardboard.

What seems to indicate that to you? I'm not criticisizing, just trying to understand.
 
Jen Fulkerson
gardener
Posts: 1690
Location: N. California
778
2
hugelkultur kids cat dog fungi trees books chicken cooking medical herbs ungarbage
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I guess compacted is a better word.  It just seems like the paper and cardboard  kind of binds itself together. I just wonder if I should add some wood chips, or something like that to aireat the bedding a bit.  I say I need to add cardboard because it seems like the amount of bedding is a lot less than ideal to me.
I checked it today. (I put a reusable ice pack on the side because it was 99 degrees today. ) There were lots of worms, and they seem fine.  
I guess using I will have to learn what is normal for this type of bin.
 
pollinator
Posts: 1429
Location: NW California, 1500-1800ft,
435
2
hugelkultur dog forest garden solar wood heat homestead
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
If you set them free and they leave, they were never really yours in the first place...

But seriously, I would put them in a place where, if the worms escape, they will be beneficial regardless. I think connecting to the ground has more benefits (biodiversity, water and temperature moderation, leaching into the garden), than cost (possibly having worms leave bin). If we give them food, water, shelter and space, in moderation and from diverse, organic sources, they will reproduce prolifically. I think the main challenge is balancing moisture, and having adequate carbon rich material can help greatly with that.
 
Posts: 672
Location: Northern Maine, USA (zone 3b-4a)
81
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I've had my worm bins for 5 yrs. now. i keep my lid off but keep the soil surface covered with newspaper or cardboard. when i take out the castings i refill with a mix of coir and newspaper and cardboard. only feed on one side of the tote so if one side gets too wet the worms can go to the drier side. make sure some indirect light can get to the top of your tote. it will discourage them from climbing the sides and making a run for it. ;)
 
steve bossie
Posts: 672
Location: Northern Maine, USA (zone 3b-4a)
81
  • Likes 1
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
if i see my bin is getting too wet and compacted i do 2 things. mix in a bunch of dry shredded cardboard and i stop feeding wet stuff and feed cheap chicken crumble. they love it and grow like crazy! also as fishing season comes i try to supplement with chic feed anyway as it fattens them up nicely. oatmeal works good for this also.
 
gardener
Posts: 650
Location: Poland
331
forest garden tiny house books cooking fiber arts ungarbage
  • Likes 2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
They need it moist but airy, and it should smell nice, like a good compost. They don't like things rotting, too wet, too heavy. And they really don't want to escape unless something's wrong.
 
It will give me the powers of the gods. Not bad for a tiny ad:
turnkey permaculture paradise for zero monies
https://permies.com/t/267198/turnkey-permaculture-paradise-monies
reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic