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How do I communicate the importance of herbs and healthy eating with my partner?

 
pollinator
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I bought Dr. Tilgner's Herbal Medicine book and am reading through it now. But I have a partner who is giving me grief and I need advice on how to deal with him.

He's on beta blockers and statins after having a heart attack. I'm not asking him to change any of the drugs he's currently taking. What I AM asking him to do is try to help me (1) get out of the habit of drinking alcohol every day, for health and financial reasons and (2) start thinking about herbal teas he can drink for enjoyment and to help him be healthier.

I thought I'd won him over when he started drinking green tea. He stopped bringing booze home (I have more trouble with it than he does, so that's why I want it out of the house) and started enjoying afternoon and evening teas. He was glowing about how much better he felt and that he was losing weight, and his mood was definitely better than his usual grumpy impatient self. (Don't get me wrong: we've been together 40 years. I love the man, and this is a feature, not a bug.)

Anyway, suddenly, he read something online that made him think green tea is contraindicated for him with the medicines he's taking, and now he's extremely suspicious of trying ANYTHING. He was even saying he didn't think he could drink peppermint tea, that he was sure if green tea was bad for him that anything that's "being pushed on the internet" must be bad for him...so, I confess, I got a wee bit irritated and pitched a wee little fit. Which always results in him getting mad at me.

So the question is, can you recommend any tactics that might persuade him when he doesn't really want to be persuaded BY ME? If he finds the information himself, he's far more likely to "discover the benefits" and accept them. Otherwise, it's "What did you put into this?" every time I put something on the table. (He knows about that sneaky organic cook thing.)

Oh, and you probably know this, too: Anytime I suggest something he's eating might be having a negative effect on his health ("Those honey buns are probably feeding your yeast infection, you know"), he says "Everything's bad for you! There's no point worrying about it! Everything is going to kill you!" But he's terrified of green tea....



 
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How is your relationship with your family doctor?  Whenever I try new herbal treatment, I discuss it with my doc.  At first it was to see if there are any contraindications with the meds I was on, but the doctor thought it was good to see what results these home treatments have.  So the doc often runs tests before and after a few months to see if it makes a measurable difference.  Sometimes it does help, sometimes the results are Stop Immediately!  

By combining traditional healing, with measurable testing, I've managed to save a lot of money avoiding the treatments that weren't working, and to find what works with my individual body.

It's also a good way to get skeptical family members on board because if they don't trust herbs, they will probably trust a doctor.
 
pollinator
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That's hard. It's tough when normally intelligent people reject reason.

If you're the one who makes the food, just make the healthy food. He can eat it, or starve. You can be nice about it and prepare what he likes using better ingredient sourcing.

With his health issues, you're not going to get anywhere unless you can get his doctor to agree that yes, this isn't contraindicated, and yes, this does have the cardiovascular effect you're looking for, etc..., or at least that's the impression I get from your post.

My much-better-half's family got us a 10-piece set of brand-new Hard Titanium T-fal pots, and she insists we use them. She has thrown out all our old stainless steel pots but the pasta pot with the integrated strainer. It's the newest coating, and we're using paranoid-levels of caution around them, and as each one gets scratched, I will "donate" it, either to the second-hand store or the garbage.

In some cases, you need to compromise. You need to choose your battles and make incremental, tiny shifts, ones so small that, looking back upon it, he couldn't tell where or what the change actually was.

I would keep the most recent information you can find on the potential harm that beta-blockers and statins can do near at hand. If you do get a chance to ask his doctor any questions, those should be in your repertoire. Also, if you can find a nutritionist, or someone he knows whose objective opinion he trusts (he trusts you, but your opinion is too subjective, I guess) that is conversant on the nutritional steps that can be taken to improve cardiovascular health, that would be a good route to take. He's probably already on a special diet for recovery, right?

Anyway, I am sorry you're in this position. I hope you find issues that you can discuss together that will increase your shared accepted knowledge of the subject and make these discussions easier. Please keep us posted, and good luck.

-CK
 
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Since the internet is now riddled with fake news, it can sometimes be hard to try and objectively assess/trust what you read so I don't blame him for being sceptical although he does seem to be now throwing the baby out with the bathwater.  Obviously heeding possible angles of websites is useful in ascertaining the likely truth of a given situation e.g. under 'home' or 'about us' or whether it's a commercial site selling products.

As I'm sure you realise, replacing alcohol with another drink is just one strategy for tackling alcohol abuse.  Changing a mindset/habits can be influenced by many other means, possibly following an interest/cause via voluntary work, exploring your (perhaps latent) creativity, going for walks with a scenic view and emphasising/celebrating what you have in common would be beneficial.  Might there be exercises that you could share together e.g. suited to his condition?
 
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Diane Kistner wrote:I So the question is, can you recommend any tactics that might persuade him when he doesn't really want to be persuaded BY ME? If he finds the information himself, he's far more likely to "discover the benefits" and accept them. Otherwise, it's "What did you put into this?" every time I put something on the table. (He knows about that sneaky organic cook thing.)

Oh, and you probably know this, too: Anytime I suggest something he's eating might be having a negative effect on his health ("Those honey buns are probably feeding your yeast infection, you know"), he says "Everything's bad for you! There's no point worrying about it! Everything is going to kill you!" But he's terrified of green tea....



Your partner reminds me of my dear hubby.  I got tired of hearing how he doesn't like something I fix using the same recipe I have used for many years. Its too bland because he has ruined his taste buds with lots of hot sauce.  I used his recipe for chili, exactly.  He told our daughter it wasn't fit to eat and that a can of chili would taste better.

I finally told him that the only thing I could cook that he liked was bacon so from now on he could have bacon for supper or fix what ever he wanted.  He soon got tired of bacon and found the hot links in the freezer.

He also went through the honey bun phase until the company started putting fewer honey buns in the package and charging more.

I learned years ago that a person can't change someone else.  They need to learn for themselves. Trying to guide them just doesn't work for me.

I would like to suggest that there are other things besides green tea that can be healthy and create healthy habits.  I feel that water is really good and good for you.  Lemonade and fruit juices are good, too.

 
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I do a lot of stuff my wife wants me to do, simply because I love her and I view it as a tiny gift to her (I also realize she is correct an uncomfortable percent of the time).  Sometimes I won't go out of my way too far (if it's not a big deal to me, I often just forget), but if she hands me a vitamin or a pill, I will certainly take it.  She goes on health kicks all the time and I mostly just go along for the ride. (I was not a fan of her gluten free kick, but I went along with it).  I don't expect to live forever, I'm a little fatalistic about it.  I realized a long time ago that the majority of factors determing how long I live are out of my control (genetics, accidents, disease, accumulated damage I have done to my body over the decades).  I do what I can.  What is easily in my control is making my wife happy and my life more pleasant as a result.  Happy Wife, Happy Life!

I would simply ask him if he will do it as a gift to you. Maybe it won't help his health, but it almost certainly won't hurt and it will make you feel better.  

I am one of thousands of babies in the mid 50's that face dramatically higher cancer risk (thyroid cancer, along with lots of cataracts) by mainstream medicine 'experimenting' (read, 'this should help, lets try it') by giving massive doses of radiation to the head for ear infections.  I lost an eye due to an 'oopsie' during an eye surgery brought on by a cataract I developed in my 30's.   I have pain in that eye every day.  We are obviously more advanced than we were in the 50's, but the practice of medicine is still very experimental.  Every body is different.  

Since the 'practice' of medicine is littered with the bodies of millions of 'oopsies', my trust in doctors is not 100%.  It's not that I think they are not doing the best they can, I just think they are usually working on short time constraints, often don't really listen to the patients, and are at the mercy of the pharmeceutical salesmen for their understanding of many of the drugs.  I've often read that we have somewhere in range of 100,000 deaths a year in U.S. hospitals due to 'mistakes' in medicines provided.  (I'm not sure how you would determine that, the hospitals sure won't volunteer the information).  The upshot of this and the previous paragraph, is that the doctors, bless their hearts and good intentions, don't know nearly as much as they want us to believe they do.  

Sir Issac Newton said "I do not know what I may appear to the world, but to myself I seem to have been only like a boy playing on the seashore, and diverting myself in now and then finding a smoother pebble or a prettier shell than ordinary, whilst the great ocean of truth lay all undiscovered before me."  I believe his saying applies very much to the practice of medicine.
 
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r ranson wrote:How is your relationship with your family doctor?  Whenever I try new herbal treatment, I discuss it with my doc.  At first it was to see if there are any contraindications with the meds I was on, but the doctor thought it was good to see what results these home treatments have.  So the doc often runs tests before and after a few months to see if it makes a measurable difference.  Sometimes it does help, sometimes the results are Stop Immediately!  

By combining traditional healing, with measurable testing, I've managed to save a lot of money avoiding the treatments that weren't working, and to find what works with my individual body.

It's also a good way to get skeptical family members on board because if they don't trust herbs, they will probably trust a doctor.



This is excellent advice!!! I am partial to exercise, diet, and lifestyle solutions but medications are sometimes necessary. Your family practitioner or even your pharmacist has the education on interactions or the resources to check if they are not specifically familiar to help guide use. As a healthcare provider I wish more people had this type of approach to their own health.
 
pollinator
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I'm with everyone that says to make healthy food and let him eat it or not.  My lady and I went through a somewhat similar thing, except I am the one that doesn't like certain things, like that spray non-stick crap that comes in the can.  I asked her not to use it.  She does it anyway.  So now I cook my own food.  When I'm getting it ready, I ask her if she wants me to make enough for both of us.  Sometimes she does, often times not.  We're both okay with the arrangement.  

As far as getting him to switch alcohol for tea, or things of that nature, there is very little you can do.  No matter how well-intentioned your reasons, I personally think everyone should have the right to live as they like, as long as they aren't hurting someone else.  And by that, I mean directly hurting others, not "well if he dies early, that will hurt me, so he should eat better".  Not saying you present it that way, but I can see that side of it.  It isn't untrue, it just doesn't fall in line with my opinion of the way the world should work.  There is a fine line to walk between helping someone and making them do what you want them to do in some cases.  I just strongly believe in personal freedom and in personal responsibility.  It's hard to step back when you want to help someone and you know a better way, but they aren't ready to hear it.  Maybe he will be at some point, but if he isn't ready to hear you yet, you may just have to be patient and hope he comes around.  In my experience, pushing to hard just makes people dig their heels in.  Sometimes the best thing to do is just present as good an example as you can and press on.
 
Trace Oswald
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Anne Miller wrote:He told our daughter it wasn't fit to eat and that a can of chili would taste better.



I can't imagine anyone saying that and expecting that person to ever cook for them again.  I would be very tempted to come home from the store with a bag full of cans of chili.
 
pollinator
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He is right to be concern, garlic+ginger+ prescribed blood thinners can be a deadly combination.
Statin was discovered/isolated from a fungus. And red yeast rice, a healthy rice has alot and could easily double dose someone, in fact just regular oyster mushroom has a good amount too.
Even something as simple as coffee can give a 400% increase risk of heart attack. https://www.webmd.com/heart-disease/news/20060815/coffee-may-trigger-heart-attack

I am however glad to hear that he is working with you and supporting you by bringing home less alcohol.
Personally, before even moving into herbal. I like to start with:
1) drinking 1 gallon of water a day
2) sleeping from 9:50pm to 6am.
3) doing meditative stretches/yoga/walks
4) eating more greens and mushroom and less grains (corn, flour/pasta/etc, rice), use more condiments(fermented) and seasoning (herbs)
5) being more grateful.

You can try elderberry wine vs just regular alcohol, kefir soda, their are alot of alternatives.

I think it is okay to tell him that you are going to cook and feed him statin like red yeast rice, and for him to google it and then make an informed decision. In fact get ahead of the problem and tell show him some articles with pros and cons. And then let him make the decision.  

I think that the 'stress' from him being afraid of green tea but yet still pressured into drinking it, might offset any of the positive compounds in the green tea.  I would say give him the info that you find now, wait 6months and he will 'discover' it online (after you already primed him), and then he will do it himself.

 
Diane Kistner
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Oh, my! What wonderful advice to come in to find this morning! All of it very good, and it gives me lots to think about. So much that I'm going to send all of this thread to my Kindle so I can re-read it at night when I wake up with my typical 45 minutes of insomnia!

That chili story was really funny. Hormel Chili with Beans, anyone? I make great pots of chili and freeze it into can-sized servings (but "I don't want to fool with defrosting it, I want it quick"), and it costs a whole heck of a lot less than the Hormel crap and is healthier to boot. But you've reminded me how well the whole laundry thing worked out. Thirty years ago, I was picking up his laundry, washing it, drying it, folding it, and then handing it to him with the request that he put it away. One day I found stacks of this clean, folded laundry lying on the floor of his closet, mixed in with all the dirty clothes. So I quietly said to him, "I will never do your laundry again." So a few weeks go by, and he comes in one morning raging about not having any clean shirts and what was he going to do, he had to go to work. I didn't say a word. So he's in the bathroom spraying the armpits of his shirt with Lysol...then goes to work...then comes home and starts a load of laundry. He's been doing his own laundry ever since.

My comments about how sexy I think men are who get into cooking or how, if I ever won the lottery I'd hire a live-in cook, have fallen on deaf ears...so maybe it's time to just go quiet. LOL!

And the booze...I'm continuous-brewing kombucha and that's gonna work...for me.





 
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When I was pregnant, I realized that if you google [any herbal tea] + pregnancy + risk, you'll find someone somewhere who says that such and such herb will kill your baby. 100% of the time. There's just not enough research done on herbs, barely any research done on pregnant women (ethically, it's almost impossible to do) and way too many people with unfounded opinions in the world.

So my common sense approach has been "anything I'd use as a food/seasoning is ok in reasonable amounts, as long as it's not explicitly indicated as dangerous from a large official medical group" (e.g. Canadian association of obstetrics).
But I avoided using any herbs or even food in quantities that would require exceptional effort to ingest (e.g. using juicing to eat more greens that you could reasonably chew on your own, or forcing myself to drink liters and liters of a given tea). And I tried to vary what I was drinking.

For statins, specifically, the medical establishment answer seems to be that green tea in large amounts could cause more cramping. one source. If your husband is having more statin-related cramps when he drinks green tea, he has his answer. If not, a cup or two a day should not cause issues. And he can vary with other forms of tea (rooibos for instance)
 
Mick Fisch
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I totally agree with what Kenna said,

So my common sense approach has been "anything I'd use as a food/seasoning is ok in reasonable amounts, as long as it's not explicitly indicated as dangerous from a large official medical group" (e.g. Canadian association of obstetrics).
But I avoided using any herbs or even food in quantities that would require exceptional effort to ingest (e.g. using juicing to eat more greens that you could reasonably chew on your own, or forcing myself to drink liters and liters of a given tea). And I tried to vary what I was drinking



It seems like anytime I call the drs office with a question they always say either "Better come in so we can check it out" or, if it's too late in the day, "Better go to the emergency room".  In our litigious society, "yes, it's ok" is a dangerous thing for them to say.  It's the same with herbs, or anything associated with pregnant women or babies.  I appreciate that they need to be careful, but there is such a thing as being careful to the point of stupid.  I'm pretty sure if a pregnant woman asked, her dr would tell her that she'd better avoid chocolate cake, just to be on the safe side.  I can imagine him/her saying "Chocolate cake may be dangerous!  Tests have shown that women who eat 5 lbs of the chocolate cake a day, gain weight and suffer increased health problems as a result!"

Herbal treatments get the same treatment.  Not a lot of research on a lot of the stuff, so the 'experts' will either tell you to avoid it or tell you "not enough research has been conducted to determine if this is safe".  (I always imagine this phrase being said with scary organ music in the background).  If the dr. didn't tell your husband to avoid tea or coffee (since these are common daily drinks in our society) I would assume it isn't a problem with reasonable amounts of consumption.
 
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Trace Oswald wrote:... like that spray non-stick crap that comes in the can.



I have similar sentiments, but I discovered that there are non-toxic alternatives. I'm not trying to advertise or sell anything, just want to inform. My wife and I found an avocado oil spray. It's avocado oil and compressed air. Just FYI!

https://www.amazon.com/Chosen-Foods-Propellant-Free-Pressure-High-Heat/dp/B077RMF6CP?ref_=ast_bbp_dp
 
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