if they are 6 volt deepcycle wet batteries then they are most likely good. They probably wont last as long as they could have but water them, then give them 3 or 4 charged to 50 percent discharged cycles and they should bounce back. If not still worth $15 a core...
Good find! David
I would suggest a thicker wire from batteries to the inverter. Technically is should be 4 or 2 gauge... at least a multi strand 6 gauge to reduce losses through the wire. Where abouts are you? If you get cloudy periods of the year I would suggest you get an mppt charger so that you can run 2 strings of 2 panels each and get some charging on those cloudy days. As voiced above get more charger then you need right now. An mppt charger will also let you change the array without having to rewire to the batteries...
Cheers, David
Chris Watson wrote:Is this an efficient idea? Is it affordable? I've seen premade units offered for sale at absurd prices. I'm wondering if I could do better and power an entire homestead.
Hi Chris, as mentioned above charcoal is a great way to get into the gasification game. I make charcoal while heating my house. you could assume that to replace 1 gallon of gasoline you would require roughly 11-13 lbs of charcoal. If you use a wood gasifier you could assume roughly 20 lbs of wood to replace 1 gallon of gasoline. Charcoal builds are much simpler but you must make the charcoal. If you have use for the heat it is the clear winner. If the amount of fuel you need is large a raw wood unit would be the way to go. The best site online for anything woodgas related is www.driveonwood.com in the small engine section. Most of the content is free including many DIY plans. There is a premium side as well for the more advanced designs. I would suggest you start there. There are a lot of "look at me" videos on youtube with little in the way of follow up or engine longevity numbers. I have over 40 hours on my charcoal gassifier tractor and about 40 on a generator conversion.
Cheers, David
B Deereborne wrote:Currently nearing completion of our home build. Initially the heating system is an in floor radiant on basement level, along with a wood stove. Down the road, planning on a rocket heater to replace the wood stove. I also have room and basic foundations to pre-heat the radiant with solar and / or a mulch pile.
I’d be very interested in updated info on this thread
Boy old thread! I would say for radiant just use a heat exchanger to keep the potable water loop and the radiant water loops seperate is a great place to start. I use A 5 micron filter and uv treatment of my well water and usually shock the system quarterly with bleach as I have a dug well prone to spring flooding. If you are going to heat water using an alternative method again a heat exchanger is a great idea as it keeps the volume of standing water to a small amount and everytime you use any hot water you are flushing the system. Think a large reservoir of alt heated water and a copper pipe coiled through it as it comes in from the well and heads to the hot water heater as opposed to trying to heat the water you use directly...
There is this thread here: https://permies.com/t/62685/Insurance-company-RMH-style-heater ontario resident who got one insured. That does not match my experience though.
My insurance company insisted on a epa certified unit and a Wett inspection. Your results might differ. Do not think you can sneak one in and expect the insurance to honour a claim even if the stove was not the culprit. Any reason to deny they would has been my experience. Consult and follow their guidelines would be my advice. Different insurance companies have different requirements so shop around.
There is some merit to the certifications as Ontario has a very strict building code which produces incredibly tight houses. Any stove would need outside air capability and be sealable to resist partial negative pressure due to mechanical air exchange.
Cheers, David
Viruses in north American water are usually not a concern where I use it ecoli is. You could chlorinated with bleach if it was. Then let it sit to let the chlorine evaporate.
Stihl make a biodegradable natural based bar chain oil. If you are concerned with the effect of bar oil on your land that is what I would use. If its money the cost and environmental impact of burning through chains and bars is worse then petroleum oil. I've tried the stihl biodegradable and it works great only problem is it does not come in summer and winter weight just summer. Here I had to special order it from a dealer...
Go for it! I would say have you thought about wood gasification instead of steam? Use 1/3 the wood as steam and use any internal combustion engine around and either power equipment directly or electrically through a generator and no boiler... just a thought... here is a good site with real solid builders on it www.driveonwood.com
In the small engine side there currently is a sawmill build happening using a small car engine and a wood gasifier... direct powering of industrial equipment with wood...
Cheers, David
Hi gabe. I see an eco fan on top do you have a hole in the back cowling for a blower? You will get significant increases of heat off the stove with it. If not get a box fan and mount it behind it on low. Push that heat at the drywall walls and let them act as your mass...
You would be better off not getting the inverter and purchasing a 12 volt pump. A single lead acid battery could not run that pump more then a few minutes at a time due to it's high draw. A RV type diaphragm pump would be perfect for the task...
Cheers, David
Samantha Buller-Kormos wrote:Our furnace system is currently being run on heating oil. They bring in a big truck and fill up the drum every 1 1/2 months or so but its quite expensive.
I don't want to get rid of the system entirely however what we got isn't working due to the rising costs of oil (thanks carbon tax).
So i'm looking at building a gasifier/boiler system to use as the main system with the heating oil as backup.
I don't leave home very often but when I do it would be nice to have that extra comfort knowing that If i don't stock the fire i'm not in trouble.
I hope i'm making sense.
Very new to this particular thing so it's difficult to explain and I have a lot to learn.
Hi Samantha, OK from the sounds of it you have a traditional forced air oil fired furnace. So the above videos are great but are more geared for hydronic heating or radiant heating...
Here is a video for a forced air furnace. I don't know enough to recommend his kits but this is the basics.
Making a gasification boiler is... not easy but a good reference is this site here www.driveonwood.com Don't let the name fool you there are a lot of threads on home gasification boilers. Any of the vehicle units the members build would provide heat but are kind of overkill for home heating uses. You can expect to burn up to 30 percent less wood then on a good conventional outdoor boiler if you go with gasification but there is a catch: Unlike traditional outdoor boilers gasification boilers are very picky about the wood they will burn. Forget all the stories you have heard of burning green wood, pallets, boxes loading up the firebox for 2 days etc... Gasification boilers like well dried uniform sized wood fed into them on a regular basis. If you are that type of person they are great. If you have ample wood in irregular sizes, have trouble getting your wood in on time, leave it in the rain, go away for a few days at a time then need lots of heat gasification is maybe not the best route and a more traditional boiler is more for you. It depends on lifestyle and priorities...
Here is a good descriptor of how a gasification boiler works. It's not an endorsement but illustrates how they all work:
The most common way of solving this would be a downdraft gasification boiler usually placed outside with a water loop to the house. A radiator goes in the existing furnace plenum and the conventional oil furnace takes over if the water temp goes too low. Was that what you were thinking?
My biggest regret was commiting to solar panels on the roof and not putting them on the ground. I was influenced by a lot of the 1970's solar design books mostly built in more southern climes. I ended up having to build a cupola into the attic to make cleaning them off easy in the winter as it snows here... a lot.
Since the house was built as a cube for efficiency (3 floors, 430ft each) the roof does not have a large footprint. When the price of panels dropped I did not have the room on the roof to take advantage of a much larger array. The passive solar aspects work great the propane dryer and hot water heater and stove were the right decision at the time but we hooked up to the grid eventually to replace the propane back up generator. Next house which is in the design stage will have a net metered array with battery backup and be an all electric house... Ontario's grid is mostly nuclear and Hydro electric so all electric makes sense. If I lived where the grid was mostly coal or natural gas the decisions would be different... So, ground array, Use the grid if its available, all electric if your utility is not all coal based.
Better in this case is not good... If someone is destitute but they have coal they will burn it... would they stop at char when 3/4 of the energy is left? Probably not...
It occurred to me to wonder what would happen if you did a retort-style pyrolysis using coal. Would the char left behind be at all akin to the char produced from fresh and dried biomass?
I then found this article that deals with the subject.
Does anyone have information on this? I mean, I know the underlying issue would still be the mined carbon being released to the atmosphere, but at least if coal was useable in a pyrolysis process that produced char that could be composted to be sequestered in the soil, less carbon would be released than through gasification or straight combustion. And all the volatiles would be cooked off and burned as fuel for the process, and for whatever process all that heat would be used for.
Am I missing something?
-CK
Boy oh boy... Where angels fear to tread
Well If you burn off the pyrolysis gases from coal you will still be releasing significant CO2 into the atmosphere. PLus whatever trace elements are in the coal will end up in the air or the resulting char; lead and mercury come to mind. Removing pyrolysis gases from coal is really what making coke is for steel making. Having lived in Hamilton Ontario and seen those plumes of orange, green and brown flames and the smells that go with it I can tell you I would want no part of it. Clean coal is a political creation. Maybe not as evil but still evil...
Chris Kott wrote:That's awesome. But it does put me in mind of those ancient printer/scanner/copier/fax combo jobs of yesteryear. How much bulk is going to be built into these things just to add that functionality, and will that bulk impede functionality in other ways? Also, how does the complexity of multiple fuels affect failure conditions, both mechanical and those likely to be caused by human error?
-CK
They don't come with all the fuel kits, you can choose 1 as you wish to come with it (solid, liquid, or gas). And removing one kit will make room for another. It is a modular system. The solid fuel kit is the bulkiest, because solid fuel is not a fluid that can go through narrow tubes. But it doesn't impede use any more than the others unless you're dead-set on having a passenger. The solid kit also has a pto-driven mill that pulverizes and compresses whatever solid fuel you want to use in record time. You can toss logs into it and they come out as fuel nuggets. Theoretically, you could use a mixture of different solids to make the nuggets: such as coal, char, hay, straw, wood logs, branches, paper, hemp, corn stalks, yard waste, peanut shells, empty bean pods, chaff from grains, old seed catalogues, etc...
Ryan it the solid fuel option tested and out there? I would love to see some links to what you have done so far. I am heavily involved in charcoal gasification and am always interested in a better mousetrap...
Cheers, David
Allen Schneider wrote:I have 3-15 watt solar panels, a total of 45 watts, what size batteries can I use and what size inverter? I might use it to light a light bulb, just small things, Any help would be appreciated, Tganks
Allen, I assume the panels you have are one of those 3x15 watt thin film kits that are sold? Usually they come with a basic charge controller. You will want to plug them into a battery of course. Stick to 12 volt appliances and lights or usb charged devices for using the power. The losses in an inverter will eat away at your solar gain except in small doses. if you use an inverter turn it off when not in use. Those kits are a fun way to start on solar. Your true wattage will be closer to about 30 watts per hour as the manufacturers play with the numbers a bit. The panels are probably rated at 15 watts at 18 volts... so roughly .85 amps at 18 volts... You are charging at 12 volts so you will get .85 amps x12 volts off each panel or about 30 true watts per hour of sun. You will want to change the angle to the sun to get better production as the day advances as that charge controller cannot compensate for changing sun levels...
Cheers and have fun, David
for most of the small stuff you mentioned I would say the tuff bilt tractor people have the right idea: https://www.tuff-bilt.com/tractors.html its a gas engine so power it with gas, propane, woodgas, e85... I don't know if they offer it in diesel...
If there is water down there water is the medium to use. Much better heat exchange and 1200 times the density of air... so much less energy to move water then air.
In a cold climate I would go for a modular home not a double wide. Usually the insulation and seal of the house is much better cutting your costs down the road. Dont be stingy on the basement either. Icf if you can afford it foam insulated on the outside as a minimum. If you do stay in place think about having the hard sit down financial talk with dad now and put it in writing. What do both parties expect? What is the time frame? What financial shape is the farm in? Tough tough questions but necessary. We do not do that as a culture but I know at least two examples of people who ended up with nothing who were "supposed" to inherit. An aging dad changed his mind and reversed mortgaged the farm in one case and a sudden death without will and a mother who sold it and split it evenly between all siblings in the other...
thomas rubino wrote:Hi David;
What make / model freezer were you planning on purchasing? With the R600 and the 9cm thick walls?
I did a quick search and did not find any AC products willing to mention how thick the insulation is.
It will be good information for me to share with my on grid friends.
the danby premiere line was the one I measured the wall thickness on. I could not find specs on the insulation on their standard brochure though...
thomas rubino wrote:Hi David;
Thanks for your response, and your opinion. I respect everyone's opinion, I just might not follow it.
One reason I'm choosing to go DC rather than AC, is not needing to keep an inverter in an unheated barn. One less, expensive electronic item to unexpectedly go bad. The barn currently does have AC from the house system. I would like to eliminate that all together. Leave it in place , just stop using it daily.We do shut off the house power each night. A stand alone DC can just do its thing. I will be remote monitoring the freezer temps in the event of a problem.
Occasional lighting in the barn and attached wood shed plus the freezer are the only needs for power out there.
As far as modern a/c fridges. I personally know of none that come close to the insulation thickness the sun danzer has, 9cm thick. I could be wrong. It does use the R134 refrigerant.
Another thing is construction, a steel outer shell and an aluminum inner. The conventional ones I have seen are plastic inside. Some have auto defrost... lets see, thaw your food to melt the ice and then refreeze it ??? Seems counter productive to me. If my freezer needs defrosting, I'll just do it during the winter.
As far as 2 smaller freezers. I considered it but decided against it.. We raise a pig each year, we shoot at least one elk and 2 deer and some years we buy a 1/2 beef, plus all the produce from the garden. I would rather have a large organized freezer than two smaller packed ones.
From reading in other forums I expect the sun danzer to pull 3-5 amps @ 12vt I'm pretty confident no AC freezer will draw that little, or need to run as infrequently as a super insulated one.
I realize that our 1970's freezer is about as inefficient as can be. It has to go.
We plan on offering it free to any single parent who needs one.
Thank you for the response. Everyone has different conditions on the ground. I can tell you from experience that my 10 year old Frigidaire 5.5 CU Ft set to 3/4 thermostat holds -17C and uses approx 400W Hr per day in the heated basement. It has metal exterior and aluminum interior as well. Manual defrost. This is actually 25 percent below its Energy start rating which makes me wonder. I will be buying a R600A unit when we build the new house which has the 9cm insulation and manual defrost. I totally understand the desire to avoid the inverter if you shut it off at night. Its not much of a possibility here anymore with the mandated arc fault plugs, ground fault plugs, and hardwired Smoke an CO detectors that have a tiny continuous draw.
Cheers, David
Interesting. I respect your opinion on this a great deal. Usually we consult people to go with AC fridges and freezers so I have questions for you. Did you think of going with an off the shelf AC model? Standard AC appliances have come a long way in 20 years almost matching the dc options. Energy usage is slightly higher but cost is a third the money which could buy more panels.
Next would be did you consider splitting the purchase into two smaller AC units? During low freezer season you can just shut one off making up for any energy loss. Up to 9Cu Ft you can get the R600a freezers that claim a 10 percent lower energy usage over R134a which I think Sundanzer still uses. I have not seen a DC freezer using R600a yet... Is servicing of the unit available where you are? A client of mine opted for a SunDanzer and their ability to service the unit here was non existent. 6 years and dead as a doornail. Their customer service was just plain awful and no local refrigeration tech would touch them.
With the utmost of respect; curious not confrontational.
Cheers, David
My partner has a Mazda 3 and it is a great efficient machine. I have a ford explorer for those times we need to haul trailers or just pack in heavy loads. Both are great at what they do. Driving the Mazda alone versus the explorer with 4 people the explorer uses less fuel per person mile... of course the best option is all 4 in the mazda... the added bonus is if we can leave the explorer in the driveway most of the time it only rolls when I'm making money so it is just a tool with a high hourly cost. I've never needed a truck even with 20 plus years of construction behind me and have always used SUVs to do the heavy stuff.
I live in the UK and will be buying a ground floor garden flat soon. Based on the flats I've viewed so far, I will probably end up with a solid wall Victorian property - which will probably have a gas combi boiler for water/heat when I buy it.
Would be interested to hear some initial thoughts on whether it's likely to be beneficial in cash and/or energy-use terms for me to consider alternative systems for water and/or space heating? Possibly a ground heat pump or a wood burning system? I read a bit recently about masonry stoves being very efficient, but I'm new to permaculture and there seem to be so many different options to choose from. I also read that it's often not worth changing any type of heating system until it comes to the end of its life (due to the embodied energy used to make the device), even if it's not very efficient.
It seems clear that I'll need to do lots of work on insulation, with hopefully some passive solar elements incorporated into the alterations that I make to the building (but I need to do lots more research first because I only have a basic grasp of all this so far).
if the existing system is at end of life with your climate I would look at air to air heat pumps or geothermal depending on what runs your electrical grid. If it's a natural gas ele tropical grid anyways stick to a natural gas heater if there is a lot of wind and low carbon power; heat pump. Wood heat is a great source of heat if you have the wood. If not it can be part of the problem...
Cheers, David
Ian Sa wrote:I would like some help in finding a wood burning electric generator. The generator could be powered by hot air or steam. No computer chips in it. (re EM Pulse). Many thanks in advance.
Ian, based on my reading I would say unless the generator happens to be running when the flare or emp occurs it should be fine. Taken one step further if the pulse was strong enough to short out a magneto in an internal combustion engine. The power generation side of the generator would also be affected whether it was turned by steam or air... While steam might seem like a good solution the boiler part of the equation is always overlooked. boilers are easy to build but hard to build safely. A boiler failure can be a catastrophic deadly event. Sterlings are interesting but while they are THERMALLY very efficient the amount of energy they can transfer from heat to shaft power is quite small... After much experimentation I settled on charcoal gasification to run small internal combustion engines as the most efficient solution for the DIY builder.
Cheers, David
Thanks David,
Reading further in the wikipedia link, it appears that a Swedes have powdered submarines with them (Sterling). I'm not saying sterling or other hot-air, but the picture I showed was of 1951 electric generator built by Philips and powering an portable generator (small power I would guess and they only made 30).
But getting back onto what I am looking for:
1. I want something with no chips in it.
2. This is for when the grid is down - for the count
3. I was hoping there is a commercially sold one.
My understanding is that all generators - connected or not are burnt-out. That is the ones powering the local water system, the gas lines, and on and on. All the cars of the last 25 years are out of commission - all their chips are gone. (connected or not).
I have delved into the rabbit hole on pulses - and it watched many Youtubes. In one they said that even if you line a room completely as long as there is a hole in the lining (e.g.) your wiring - or as you say you plug in - your computers are gone. My conclusion was that all of this is speculation and people talking through their hats. However, the only way to know is to build a EM pulse "gun" (from some microwave ovens or buy one) and zap your car/generator/whatever and see if it is toast.
So that is a rabbit hole and I'll just avoid anything with a chip in it.
Probably an old gas lawnmower with a pull-start (you know the handle with the rope) - or old outboard engine for a boat - with a pull-cord would be chip-less. Anything build prior to when they had chips in things (say 1960's ?). Anything with a push-button electronic start is probably a "no-go"
As to the power source it could be many things I don't really care - except that I am a strong environmentalist and so I'm going to go green.
My reading on hot-air engines are that they are not "power-dense" that is for lots of power in small size (like a car) they went to internal combustion and interest was lost in hot-air engines.
I short of time. I don't want to build one unless I have to.
On efficiency, internal combustion engines waste a lot of energy in heat production (like 75-90%). Wood gasification is only going to get part of the energy of the wood -(correct?).
HI Ian, so the sterling examples you refer to are pressurized units very expensive, very complex. Of those units their ability to use energy to produce electricity would be in line with an internal combustion engine. Approx 30 percent is transfered to shaft power in a modern IC engine. Homebuilt low pressure steam probably about 7-9 pecent The best high pressure stirlings about 30 percent to shaft power the rest to thermal energy. Again it won't be the engine part that gets you in a pulse it will be the electrical generation equipment end that would fry on you. Usually most people looking at emp proofing equipment settle on surge protection using Ferrites and component isolation or equipment storage in emp proof containers. The US army did do some emp testing and developed emp standards for most equipment. I wish you luck on your search... If you want more EMP solutions I would recommend this book here: https://www.amazon.com/EMP-Protect-Community-Electromagnetic-Protection-ebook/dp/B01CDFGUDU Cheers, David
Does the unit have a built in defrost cycle? Is the unit powered on all the time or is the thermostat controlling the on off at the outlet? I ask because often when you switch at the outlet at start up it runs a short defrost cycle which might account for the heating. I would try disabling the heater if possible and manually running it from time to time if that is the case.
Ian Sa wrote:I would like some help in finding a wood burning electric generator. The generator could be powered by hot air or steam. No computer chips in it. (re EM Pulse). Many thanks in advance.
Ian, based on my reading I would say unless the generator happens to be running when the flare or emp occurs it should be fine. Taken one step further if the pulse was strong enough to short out a magneto in an internal combustion engine. The power generation side of the generator would also be affected whether it was turned by steam or air... While steam might seem like a good solution the boiler part of the equation is always overlooked. boilers are easy to build but hard to build safely. A boiler failure can be a catastrophic deadly event. Sterlings are interesting but while they are THERMALLY very efficient the amount of energy they can transfer from heat to shaft power is quite small... After much experimentation I settled on charcoal gasification to run small internal combustion engines as the most efficient solution for the DIY builder.
Cheers, David
I am obsessive about my headlamps. I trouble shoot solar a fair bit and more times then not there is no power... Then it gets dark here at 4:30 during the dark times of year so it helps get stuff done. The girls each have one as well and enjoy winter chicken visits while wearing them. I have them all on rechargeable batteries so not too much waste involved.
S Haze wrote:Since this experiment began I think the understanding of how artificial light and its parameters like wavelength and flicker rate affect us has come a long way! The image is one I've seen before and sums up why CFLS especially might be not-so-good for us as biological organisms. The webpage I pulled it from seems fairly comprehensive and legit too.
https://iristech.co/blue-light-filters-ultimate-guide/
I don't know how much faith I would put in a website that is trying to sell me a software app to counter blue wavelength light since that filtering is available for free on my phone and computer. I have been using the full spectrum "daylight" LED at home. I like their more balanced colours can't quantify any difference for me.
Stacy Witscher wrote:The off-grid solar people that I have talked to just don't have any interest in dealing with my battery system, I'm not sure that I could convince them otherwise. And they are considered by many as the best off-grid solar people in southern Oregon. I need some time to gain enough knowledge to deal with things myself.
I was looking into what was triggering the generator, but then my grandbaby died, and life has been in standstill since. Some think it is a problem between the outback charge controllers and the xantrex inverters, but I don't know.
Sorry to hear about your loss... First off usually if its a xantrex inverter the AGS controls work through that. What model? green and white rectangle? the older SW? I know one of the problems we face in the solar industry is its growth rate. As it grows so fast the real "money" is in install. Tweaking and upgrading is finicky and time consuming. Then if you" fix" something on an older system and an equally old component fails you all of a sudden "own" the problem. It is so common the former company I consulted for stopped doing upgrades and concentrates only on full systems now. I like to tinker so its a good niche for me. If I were you I would carefully read over your Aquions manual especially about the absorb time required. Usually absorb time on the xantrex AGS has a default amount of hours that is set up for Lead acid. Lead acid requires several hours of absorb to get from say 75 percent to 90 percent"full" The Aquions do not. So right there a good solar company wanting you to get max life out of their gear sets up the generator to give maximum life to the batteries and damn the fuel usage... for lead acid, Aquions are new, not lots of experience out there so it would be easy to miss. Lots of savings there. Next comes the trigger points for the AGS. Dive in and see at what voltage it is set to turn on the generator and how long it waits to see if that voltage holds or bounces back. Aquions can take 80 percent discharge according to their literature with no problem but their max amperage draw is fairly low so something big comes on, the voltage drops fast, the Older Xantrex AGS triggers too soon and you have a wasted generator cycle. Once an AGS is triggered it runs through a full cycle it does not care if it triggered 2 minutes before the sun came out. Outback controllers are invisible to xantrex inverters and vice versa so a generator turning on 2 minutes before the solar array powers up is common since the AGS and the charge controller do not talk. The trick there is to program in a "quiet time" window in the AGS that matches the sunny parts of the day... AGS' are dumb and are a last resort failsafe that cannot match the smart human in the loop...
Lots to think about.
Cheers, David
Stacy Witscher wrote:I also have aquion batteries, and have a stack of replacement batteries as well. My main issue right now is finding someone able to help me with the battery systems should a need arise. The solar people that I had come inspect the system and walk me through some things have no experience with these batteries. My bigger issue is the backup generators, how to keep the main one from coming on so often. I don't like the amount of diesel that we use on that generator or the amount of propane that we use on the property in general, but given how difficult things have been lately, I don't want to harp on people's habits. It's been a painful, difficult thing, I don't want to make things worse.
Stacy, what kind of ags system are you using? I.e. what triggers the generators? There is a lot of tricks that can be used to lower genny time. The Aquions have unconventional set points and the standard ags settings would not cut it you would have to tweak them a bit...
Cristo Balete wrote:Sue, thanks for the info on the Nickel-Iron batteries.
The saltwater batteries, I'm glad they are working for you.
The only thing about storing batteries in a garage is if they are near a sparking type of device, like a gas heater with electronic ignition. the hydrogen gas (from lead-acid and Nickel-Iron batteries) is dangerous. It can cause an explosion. I can't imagine hydrogen gas does much good to a car paintjob.
Apparently there's some issue with compatibility with home solar equipment and nickel-iron batteries, as mentioned below.
Solar News
Disadvantages of Nickel Iron Batteries
22 November 2017
By Mario Santini
Nickel-Iron (Ni-Fe) batteries, also known as Nickel-Alkaline or Edison batteries are rechargeable batteries with a long life expectancy, high Depth of Discharge (DoD) and a reputation for durability. The battery can withstand overcharge, overdischarge and short-circuiting and yet last 20 years or more.
The disadvantages however outweigh the advantages.
Cost:
The initial cost is at least 30% over a high-end Lead Acid battery of comparable size (considering usable energy) and also still a lot dearer than Lithium-ion batteries.
Efficiency:
Nickel-Iron batteries have lower energy density and lower specific power compared to lead-acid batteries (or in layman's terms are less efficient). The cells take a charge slowly, and give it up slowly (cannot supply sudden large power spikes). This means one would need more batteries and more solar panels to achieve the output of a 'standard' lead-acid based power system. In addition, Ni-Fe batteries have a significant self-discharge rate of 1% per day.
Ventilation:
They produce a lot of hydrogen, daily gassing is required to get the expected performance. Hydrogen gas is explosive, therefore good ventilation is imperative.
Compatibility:
The characteristics of Ni-Fe batteries are not supported by most solar equipment. The voltage window is so wide that standard inverters are likely to shut themselves down well before the battery is fully discharged. Hence claims like "100% usable capacity" are exaggerated which will further add to cost, size and maintenance.
Conclusion
While not as bad as Ni-Cd batteries, RPC strongly advises against Nickel Iron batteries for home solar systems. The initial cost is unlikely to pay off unless maintenance is conducted meticulously - for decades. If you need high quality deep cycle batteries, take a look at these Lead Acid or Lithium-ion batteries.
Cristo, if you stick to the name brand manufacturers of equipment there should be no compatibility problems with nicad or NiFe batteries or lithium for that matter. The problem comes when the cheaper equipment is used without the programmable set points for absorb, float and low voltage disconnect...
Tess Daniels wrote:As to how did the Nearings buy their land in Maine....Back when they did buy. land was so cheap that practically anyone who wanted to do what they were doing, could. They had some savings and Scott was a paid teacher before a pariah. Read their books for a general idea of how they started out. Then came the young happy helpers eager to learn and hang out. It goes on from there. I live near the homestead and the Colemans. The main point here is that in those days land was very cheap. That is why Maine was the place they chose. I also want to know the financial details of how someone gets their start in an enterprise.
Not to forget the original homestead in Vermont the setting for the good life book...
Air exchange is the most important step. Areas with granite and basements are prime candidates for radon. Hrv s have been mandatory in my area for 15 years. At construction time a thick vapor barrier sealed to the foundation walls along with under slab ventilation is suggested...
Good first steps.
I did not see any bad mouthing in your posts. I understood from them that you would like to know an author's financial history before judging their advice. I get that but I think you would spend vast amounts of energy for very little reward. The western world is a culture of absolute silence on financial matters. We might brag about and flaunt affluence but We don't teach financial literacy and don't talk honestly about it sometimes even to ourselves. Build a good life, try to change what you can, teach others if they will listen, adopt what works, ignore the fools, have fun...
Cheers, David
