That is doubly-eco!  Mike, regarding the interior of PSP, have you seen any sort of clay or cob material used for the walls, or for anything? 

How about chimneys in PSP, any experience? 

Are there any sort of interior materials (other than toxic paint and all the other conventional stuff) to stay away from when building PSP?

How are the soft woods holding up, Mike?  What is the main purpose of the charring?  Are there any soft woods you would say work better than others? 

Sounds like that person Leah is speaking of would have to live naked in a sterile bubble.  Don't forget smelling your own farts too Leah!

Has there ever been an occurrence of earth ship caused sickness or death? 

That's mighty good stuff there Sue.  Think like a bug, a deer, a rat, squirrel, bird. 

There are these things called "hedge" species, like Serviceberries.  What would you do with those?  Plant a few, spread out, along the edge of a driveway with other hedge species in between them?  Or plant a few and let them do their hedge thing, cutting back as the new shoots pop out? 

I thought we were trying to grow what will be best for all life.  If I just want apple trees and plant an apple orchard, that is not permaculture to me.

Ornamental concrete leaves?  How do they function?

I am talking about re-wilding oneself.  Learning how to survive in the wild and implementing it.  Not reforestation. 

I am trying to open up space for people to share their thoughts on how to blend re-wilding of humans with permaculture.  That is my intent.

Has anyone ever imported any pets from South America?  Alpacas, Super-Cui, anything? 

huh.  Well I guess it could be alright, providing the costs are low and they make it in a local chemistry lab

Have there been studies to prove that the predator learns from the poisoning?

I have heard of several wood stove makers putting warnings in their manuals about osage orange.  Hard as a rock, yes.  Burns hot, yes.  I would take a look in that manual for your wood stove.

As far as PSP, I would say Black Locust if you can get your hands on it.  One just fell in our front yard.  Gotsa buncha them licorice ferns in it.  They taste good and all, but I have a question.  Is that a sign of a dying tree? 

Any arborists on this site?  I would love to learn more about tree analysis and assessment.

What about rubbing walnut oil onto cutting boards and spoons and ummmmmm bows?  Is that gonna kill me? 

Harvest our farts for biodiesel?

Are condoms made of rubber?  Or just latex?

Tons of Vitamin C from Doug Fir or Western Hemlock needles in tea. 

But make sure you are not a pregnant cow that eats ponderosa pine needles, because your baby might be aborted.

So I read about the economic viability of permaculture on another thread, and was inspired to put this out there.  Please don't kick me off the site

I am in this wilderness skills school that is incorporating the permaculture certification for the first time.  I feel that there are two directions, or areas of focus, that are pulling me:  re-wilding or permaculture. 

I really want to make that OR an AND.  Say you are raising meat rabbits (permaculture) but you practice your snares and deadfalls (rewilding) on them.  Or you have a garden (permaculture) and a deer comes and grazes, then you shoot it with your bow and arrow that you made from natural material (re-wilding).  Are these examples justified in the blending of these two themes?

Lets say something happens that puts the U.S. into a state of turmoil and there are bands of hungry people roaming around.  If you have a self sustaining permaculture farm, wouldn't your land be their first target? 

I like this square foot thing.  Questions though.  How deep do you dig each hole?  Do you cover it with sod after, or something else? 

What about combining the square foot shitting with the tree bog? 

In Willow's defense, it is much more than a basket tree.  It is used as the drill and/or hearth for starting friction fires.  It is a great fish smoking wood.  It is used to make snowshoes, spoons, small frames, knitting needles, fishing poles, rope (nets, lashings, etc.).  Bark used to make mats, bags, blankets and more.  Useful?

That is good info on cedar though.  And I have heard that squatting is the best way to shit and prevent large intestinal backup.  I read that in "The Last American Man".

How long did it usually take you to gather the slugs and drown them?  Do slugs benefit a farm in any way other than feed for ducks?

Who here has eaten comfrey?

Does it kill the raccoon?  Will the raccoon poop out the lithium and contaminate a healthy forest?

How do the rabbits blend with aquaponics? 

What was the major downfall of the meat rabbits?  How did you contain them? 

I think that is awesome that you raise sheep.  Props

I have a question.  How do shallow rooted plants (such as woodland strawberry and yarrow)  dynamic accumulators?  I thought that in order to accumulate nutrients, you had to have a taproot.  

Did he still have a healthy supply of earthworms the following year?

Wal Mart put up a store on the floodplains of the Upper Iowa river, just north of Decorah (my friends home town) and last year guess what happened.  Everyone went to Wal Mart to buy products that would get rid of all the damn water in their houses.  Thanks Wal Mart and Decorah city council.

Paul, you said let water in in one place.  Say you are on some land with no structures yet, just bought.  Would you set up gravity fed water ways and this berm ditch thing before building anything?

I think it would be cool to use that one inlet and branch off from it, maybe having waterways feeding storing tanks or ponds on the property.

That is true.  We have alders on the property too.  But I am thinking of putting them on the northmost end of the forest.  Maybe letting them mulch the forest themselves.  Then I don't have to gather leaves for mulch. 

I tried the cambium of alder once.  It was cool, eating wild and all, and I felt like a bear, but it was a little woody... you are right about it not being choice. 

Would it be a violation of permaculture principles to have species in a FOOD forest that aren't food?

That helps.  So would it be wise to disperse the... rhubarb for example... across the forest rather than having it clumped into one area?  How about hedge species, I am thinking of serviceberries along the driveway.  Would it be better to let them run, trimming to my liking?  Or have other species in between them?

Isn't it edible in small quantities?  I heard it is a significant source of vitamin B12 (for all you veggies). 

In Edible Forest Gardens' plant matrix it lists the width 3'-5', height 3'-5'.  If I have a 14 foot diameter apple tree dripline, how many comfrey plants should I put under the canopy?  How fast will it spread?

Only natives are allowed to spear fish salmon in western WA.  But any old feller can gig a frog.  Don't even need a hunting or fishing license.

Yikes.  I am going to change my question a bit.  Would brassica's have a good place in a food forest that requires minimum maintenance? 

I always thought of brassicas as row crops, near potatoes and tomatoes and stuff.  How about solanum species?  Anyone put them in food forests...that require minimum maintenance?

Would it be wise to plant a few red alders in a food forest?  I know the cambium is edible, and they fix nitrogen, and provide mulch with their leaves. 

I have limited space and want to put something there that will benefit the forest the most.  The two trees I were thinking of were red alder and black locust.  These would be part of an apple-based food forest.

Okay.  I was hoping you meant that.  I will make sure not to put any daffodils in a boquet.  I think it would be a good experiment to ooze out some daffodil sap into a small section of soil and see if it has any effect on pH. 

I think daffodils would be worth it in a food forest, especially if they attract insects.  Does anyone know any drawbacks to having daffodils in a  food forest?

What about integrating the willow bog and the dry outhouse.  Have your outhouse in the center with dry dirt under it.  Surround that with willows, and let them go to work. 

I am still confused on the separation of pee and poo.  Is that necessary if there is no plan of using pee in fertilizer? 

Is it really wet in your area, Quittrack?  I know red cedar is fairly rot resistant.  What kind of hardwoods do you have over there?

Would you want to build a cob house that is sunk into the earth a few feet?  I wonder what the effect of earth matted against your cob walls would be.  It is a possibility though.

Right now I don't mind not taking a vacation.  I want to work, sun up to sun down, 7 days a week.  The harder you work, the more appreciated the relaxation time.

Sheep would take up more space than the rabbits.  But the rabbits would be more work. 

Starting with a couple is wise.  How many sheep would you start out with?

Are y'all talking about putting out bait for predators? 

Ooh that's good Sue.  I like it.  Imagine how warm that would be, with the opening of the half circle to the south.  Snake habitat too.  I think that is worth a shot.  Who is going to try it?

Why would you cover them?

Alkaline sap?  Would that help raise soil pH? 

When you say cut daffodils, do you mean transplanted ones?  Or are you talking about a boquet of flowers, one being the daffodil?

Sue, did the bogs you saw list a willow species that was used?  I got an idea... plant different willow species around your toilet.  See which ones take better.  Then have a pipe going down into the ground near the crap, but deeper.  Then smell the end of the pipe after a month and see how the willows are doing.  Give me more ideas on how to monitor the willow's crap-eating-efficiency.

How does a plant "share" the nitrogen it fixes?

Which hazelnut does good in Western WA?  I know the native beaked hazelnuts are in the forests around here, but what domestic ones get real nutty?

I want to bring this up again, now that there are some more folks participating in this forum. 

Are there woods that work better for posts, roof beams, etc.?

It seems like the rot-resistant (even though they aren't ALWAYS) woods would be good choices, but I know Red Cedar is relatively soft. 

Hahaha y'all are some good folks.  I think there are numerous factors that play into kids not being raised in a giant condom.  I have chosen not to list them.

Yeah that is right.  I heard that they can get pregnant while they are pregnant.  Of course my source is not the most reliable one. 

So I know people eat lamb, but what about older sheep?  Would that be a preferred meat?

I wonder what rabbit breed would be good for fiber AND meat... New Zealand Whites maybe? 

So it looks like micro-climate is rather important if these trees will survive our winters up here.  How low did the temp. get over that last cold spell? 10 F? 

I like the south facing wall thing, maybe a black wall?  Would big stones nearby help?