truck to generator*
Permies likes southwest usa and the farmer likes Ocotillo Fences permies
  Search | Permaculture Wiki | Recent Topics | Flagged Topics | Hot Topics | Zero Replies | World Domination!
Register / Login


permies » forums » regional » southwest usa
Bookmark "Ocotillo Fences" Watch "Ocotillo Fences" New topic
Author

Ocotillo Fences

Neal Spackman


Joined: Mar 13, 2011
Posts: 82
Location: Makkah, Saudi Arabia
    
  13
Anyone have experience growing Ocotillo and using it as a fence


People are the keystone species of the planet. Twovisionspermaculture.com
                                              


Joined: Mar 30, 2011
Posts: 500

  I havent used that exact one, but ive used chollas and prickley pears. although i dont have the density built up to be a full fence yet, both are pretty slow growing as i am not watering them or anything. given enough time im sure the ocotillo, or a mix of things will work just fine, atleast for bigger animals. im guessing a rabbit may find a way to weave through it.

    im also going to use a swath of prickly pears outside a fence im building to grow my grains in. it will probably take many years to fill it in, but i figure with a swath of prickly things deers are much less likely to jump. the reason im going with prickley pears over more fencelike choices is because im working on breeding them to be spineless and have more desirable fruit. the fruit is all ready a known food in my area, atleast for those of mexican decent, and if the pads were spineless they would make a good fodder for cattle.

    i think living fences are such a great idea. i hope others with more experience with it weigh in.
Emerson White


Joined: May 02, 2010
Posts: 1206
Location: Alaska
There are already spineless pps mailable, however a dense hedge of pps might interfere with any breeding programs, since they will be sending out the same pollen every year so you will constantly be backcrossing to ancestral stock. Sorry to get off track.
                                              


Joined: Mar 30, 2011
Posts: 500
Emerson White wrote:
There are already spineless pps mailable, however a dense hedge of pps might interfere with any breeding programs, since they will be sending out the same pollen every year so you will constantly be backcrossing to ancestral stock. Sorry to get off track.


I know there are spineless ones. I couldnt be breeding them to well if there werent. i havent found one however that is spineless AND adapted to cold regions. Or has good fruit AND good in cold regions.

Also ALL the spineless ones Ive found, have those little hairs (forget the name) and those can be breed away as well......

there are no issues with my breeding program, as I never explained it. I will continue to collect various forms i find and buy. spread them as the fence. At the same time I will purposely cross the desirable fruited ones, and spineless one to the cold tolerant ones I have. grow out those seeds, and then continue from there, purposely crossing the ones that have the traits im after... until I get one that thrives here, that has good fruit, and less spines....conversely i will end up with some with bigger spines. Im going to work on some with bigger spines and taller growth habits also hopefully with good fruit as well, for fences basically while still having a wall of pads that I or animals could eat if other stuff failed.

the ones from hot regions are being kept indoors in winter, those are the spineless and desirable fruited ones. Most makking up the start of the fence at this point are local ones Ive gathered. Even those I will be slowly breeding, taking all the more desirable ones over time and moving those pads to new spots of the fence. Im not exactly trying to build the fence ASAP.

It will take a decent amount of time, because it takes many a few years to get to the point they set seeds and I can breed them, but 10 years? 15? I will have them in the forms I need. They are spread by division, through the pads, so I dont have to stabilize them like one might with other types of breeding.

this is a greatly undervalued plant. and for the record anyone in this country could do this if they wanted. not that in wet regions would it be considered to be worthwhile, but these things have a vast range, and different sub species and varieties will cross very very well. they go nearly to the arctic circle.
                        


Joined: Jan 01, 2011
Posts: 40
Location: Berkeley,CA
Glocket(spelling?) is the name for the little hairs
Emerson White


Joined: May 02, 2010
Posts: 1206
Location: Alaska
Glochid
                                              


Joined: Mar 30, 2011
Posts: 500
Emerson White wrote:
Glochid


yep thats them....
Tyler Ludens
pollinator

Joined: Jun 25, 2010
Posts: 5326
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
    
  20
Don't know if anyone mentioned it but livestock will graze the "spineless" prickly pears.  My sheep love them!  I'm growing a whole lot of them.    They are reasonably tasty for humans also.




Idle dreamer

                                              


Joined: Mar 30, 2011
Posts: 500
H Ludi Tyler wrote:
Don't know if anyone mentioned it but livestock will graze the "spineless" prickly pears.  My sheep love them!  I'm growing a whole lot of them.     They are reasonably tasty for humans also.






yep thats exactly why im working on breeding them. the fruits and pads are sold in stores here, mainly immigrants eat them. I rather like the fruit. My local ones the fruit has a decent taste, but is super seedy. All the good fruited ones, and spineless ones are from hot areas, so going to do some breeding. I never ate the pads, but like you said cattle love them, so it would be great to have one for my region as the plant grows well here... Its only a matter of time, the various prickley pear varieties breed freely, I just need to wait until they bloom at the same time, might have to play with them a bit..... animals love the pads, so its a good way for a decent feed with good water for this area. Ive seen good results out of austrailia and mexico using them. there are better feeds out there, but diversity is good of course, and backups for back ups... If they are spineless its much easier to prep them for animals. just burn off the glochids... or breed them off hopefully.

I love this plant. banana yucca to. both do really well here, and have a lot of potential for the experimental homesteader. especially after some breeding...
Tyler Ludens
pollinator

Joined: Jun 25, 2010
Posts: 5326
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
    
  20
I've not been able to get banana yucca started from seed.  I might need to buy some plants.  But I'm concerned we might not have the proper moths here to pollinate the blooms to produce "bananas." 
Emerson White


Joined: May 02, 2010
Posts: 1206
Location: Alaska
Try a paintbrush.
Tyler Ludens
pollinator

Joined: Jun 25, 2010
Posts: 5326
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
    
  20
Emerson White wrote:
Try a paintbrush.


That would probably work. 

Abe Connally


Joined: Feb 20, 2010
Posts: 1404
Location: Chihuahua Desert
I've done an ocotillo fence.  It was a lot of work, but the results were beautiful.  We broke branches off of ocotillos, being careful not to take more than 1/3 of any plant.  We then made a trench, about 6" deep for their bases.  We made panels of the ocotillos, like 30 in each panel.  We stretched a top wire for the fence, and attached the panels to that, making sure their bases were in the trench.  It took them a few months to root, but that was it.  To fence our garden, it took over 2,500 ocotillo stalks.


Living off grid - guides for the off grid lifestyle in the modern age
Homesteading - latest updates and projects from our off grid homestead
                              


Joined: May 13, 2011
Posts: 9
That is an amazing fence and I'd love to see it.  Ocotillo is so beautiful.
Abe Connally


Joined: Feb 20, 2010
Posts: 1404
Location: Chihuahua Desert
There's actually a small picture of it on this page:
http://www.velacreations.com/gardening.html ; (third photo)

I will see if I can find some more photos of it.
                        


Joined: Aug 01, 2011
Posts: 66
Location: San Diego
Be aware that collecting any part of an ocotillo, including seed, is illegal in California. You can face a heft fine if they catch you at it.
Jonathan 'yukkuri' Kame


Joined: May 23, 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Foothills north of L.A., zone 9ish mediterranean
    
    3
hoodat McCoy wrote:Be aware that collecting any part of an ocotillo, including seed, is illegal in California. You can face a heft fine if they catch you at it.


Surely, that can't apply to ocotillo you've planted on private property, can it?

BTW, anyone out there willing to share a spineless prickly pear pad or 2?
                        


Joined: Aug 01, 2011
Posts: 66
Location: San Diego
yukkuri kame wrote:
hoodat McCoy wrote:Be aware that collecting any part of an ocotillo, including seed, is illegal in California. You can face a heft fine if they catch you at it.


Surely, that can't apply to ocotillo you've planted on private property, can it?

BTW, anyone out there willing to share a spineless prickly pear pad or 2?

Ocotillo grown on private property or in nurseries must have proof of their origin, such as sales slips or they are in danger of being confiscated.
Ce Rice


Joined: Aug 31, 2012
Posts: 81
Location: Zone 8-9
    
    3
Yep. Welcome to the police state. You dont have any freedom on your own property or with your own property unless Big Brother gives that permission to you.

I love tunas. ( the Spanish name for the prickly pear fruit)
Pj Maddox


Joined: Nov 20, 2012
Posts: 14
Location: Middle Georgia
Tyler Ludens wrote:Don't know if anyone mentioned it but livestock will graze the "spineless" prickly pears.  My sheep love them!  I'm growing a whole lot of them.    They are reasonably tasty for humans also.



I LOVE Prickly Pears! When I was a kid, we used to:
knock them off with a stick, poke them onto the stick end, and roast them over a fire.
The skin and prickles would crisp up and pull off and we ate the warm YUMMY fruit!
My mouth is watering just thinking about that.


Love and Light,
Tyler Ludens
pollinator

Joined: Jun 25, 2010
Posts: 5326
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
    
  20
Pj, I'll have to try that! Great way to deal with the little spines.

wayne stephen
steward

Joined: Mar 11, 2012
Posts: 1737
Location: Western Kentucky-Climate Unpredictable Zone 6b
    
  92
Nopalitos are the young pads of prickly pear- diced and cooked they kind of taste like zuccini but are definitely "cactusy" . Traditionally eaten with eggs for breakfast. I think delicious - way better than lophophora williamsii { oh , the 70's }. Javelina eat the pads and fruit of spined prickly pear , so I imagine they would make good pig fodder too , except very slow growing.
Ocotillo would certainly make a good fence to keep people out. I once was riding my 21 speed touring bike and hit a sand patch around a corner. I went flying and crashed into the base of a ocotillo bush , knocking it down , and rolled the entire length of it. I was on my way to work and would be fired if I was late one more time. I showed up prompt , bleeding, and poked full of holes. I will never mess with an ocotillo fence.


Permaculture is CPR for the planet !


 
I agree. Here's the link: http://stoves2.com
 
subject: Ocotillo Fences
 
cast iron skillet 49er

more from paul wheaton's glorious empire of web junk: cast iron skillet diatomaceous earth sepp holzer raised garden beds raising chickens lawn care flea control missoula electric heaters permaculture videos permaculture books