Open Your Eyes Bedding*
Permies likes medicinal herbs and the farmer likes Toddler won't sleep through the night permies
  Search | Permaculture Wiki | Recent Topics | Flagged Topics | Hot Topics | Zero Replies | World Domination!
Register / Login
permies » forums » living » medicinal herbs
Bookmark "Toddler won Watch "Toddler won New topic
Author

Toddler won't sleep through the night

Burra Maluca
Mother Tree

Joined: Apr 03, 2010
Posts: 4580
Location: Portugal Zone 9 Mediterranean Climate
    
173
Does anyone have any suggestions for a sleep deprived couple with a toddler who just doesn't want to sleep through the night? 

I think it's a behaviour thing rather than a diet thing, but they just can't seem to persuade him that nights are for sleeping and staying asleep.  I have the same problem with the old man, and I give him a shot of alcohol at bedtime, which works well but it's not something you could do for a young kid.  And if my own sleep pattern gets too disturbed I take valerian, which soon gets me back on track, but I'm not sure it's appropriate for a toddler, even assuming it was possible to get it down him. 

Does anyone have any suggestions?  Is there something herbal which would help him sleep through the night?  Or is it the wrong approach?  Should they just let him 'scream it out'?  Or is there a better way? 

Any advice or suggestions gratefully received as they are getting desperate! 


What is a Mother Tree ?
Jami McBride
volunteer

Joined: Aug 29, 2009
Posts: 1779
    
  10
There is chewable melatonin that tastes like peppermint.  The brand is Nutrition Now, I get it in the health food island at Fred Meyers.  It relaxes and clams, it is not a drug.  I had friends give it to their hyper son just to take the edge off. 

Also running the child during the day, and giving him a warm bath just before bed to settle down for the evening.

But none of this will work if the parents are busy, the house is noisy, lights are on - all things signaling that the fun stuff is still going on.  No one likes to be left out of what's going on.

When my kids were young I would shut off most of the lights, sometimes light a candle, give them their daily bath and then let them watch a movie - worked every time, they were out before the movie was over.  I was also sitting quietly reading or watching the show.  No noise or activity, everything (the house and me) signaled the day was over time for bed.
T. Joy


Joined: Feb 03, 2011
Posts: 438
I don't recommend things like melatonin for children (in fact I don't recommend that for anyone) because messing with hormones is not a good idea, it confuses the body's natural production of such things and can lead to health issues down the road. Better is to focus on how to stimulate the body's own natural rhythm and sleep cycles.
I just read something somewhere about how the blue light spectrum of tv, computer screen etc inhibits melatonin production by sending an early morning wake up signal to the brain so I second the idea of dim lighting at night. A warm bath is a great idea, in fact any sort of bedtime routine that is followed faithfully will help get a body into the mood for sleep. At first this might take a bit of time but consistency is the name of the game and it will pay off. 
Not eating or drinking late at night, making sure to get enough physical activity but to calm things down well in advance of bedtime switching over to relaxing activities. This is a great time to spend together doing some colouring or playing a board game.
There is a homeopathic remedy called Calms that I hear good things about.
One final thought, at this age children should not be exposed to any television at all. Studies have shown that it actually alters the development of neural pathways which can lead to a child not being able to focus or calm themselves (ADHD, hello). Zero screen time, even secondary (as in parents are watching it around a child). That takes quite a commitment, I know, but it is either that or not getting any sleep time at night.
Tyler Ludens
pollinator

Joined: Jun 25, 2010
Posts: 5326
Location: Central Texas USA Latitude 30 Zone 8
    
  20
According to the "Home Herbal" by Penelope Ody, Chamomile and California Poppy are both safe mild sedatives for children given as a tea.  Also of course to avoid feeding any sugar late in the day. (Of course I would say don't feed sugar to children at all!  )


Idle dreamer

Max Tanner


Joined: Feb 26, 2011
Posts: 86
Location: Ontario North and South - right now, moving North Permanently soon. Timmins Cochrane areas
    
    1
I am not an expert at all and this is second hand from a customer.

Her child could not sleep through the night, she had worms. The mother treated her and the worms went away and the child slept like a baby!


http://wildernessreturn.wordpress.com/
my wilderness return story and adveture
Amber Westfall


Joined: May 26, 2011
Posts: 13
Location: Ottawa
    
    1
Chamomile and/or catnip tea.  Both very safe and gentle for little ones.  And big ones too!  Just be careful, it's so effective sometimes I fall asleep mid-sip and end up coughing!  Oh and lemonbalm is nice if there is over-stimulation, anxiety or the child tends to get hot and sweaty.


"Forgive me if I never visit. I am from the fields, you know, and while quite at home with dandelion, make a sorry figure for the drawing room" ~Emily Dickinson
alisha cornog


Joined: Dec 24, 2013
Posts: 2
I am at lost for what to do. I have a 14 month old who WILL NOT go to bed let alone stay asleep. Yes he is teething but I give him meds for it n a warm milk bottle but he still wakes up at night crying and not wanting to go back to sleep. and when I put him to bed he scream cries so bad he turns purple and red and starts shaking. I don't know what to do and I don't know what to give him since he's so young. any help will be very grateful.
Elissa Teal


Joined: Jun 05, 2013
Posts: 107
Location: Ohio (zone 6; just west of Lake Erie)
    
    1
alisha cornog wrote:I am at lost for what to do. I have a 14 month old who WILL NOT go to bed let alone stay asleep. Yes he is teething but I give him meds for it n a warm milk bottle but he still wakes up at night crying and not wanting to go back to sleep. and when I put him to bed he scream cries so bad he turns purple and red and starts shaking. I don't know what to do and I don't know what to give him since he's so young. any help will be very grateful.


Poor little guy. Have you tried co-sleeping? Letting him sleep in bed with you.


Radical Homemaker; Urban Homesteader in zone 6; Homeschoolin' Mama to 3 boys; Soul Mate to my Hubby since 1998; above all, Bride of Christ; http://crunchymamasurbanhomestead.wordpress.com/
Elissa Teal


Joined: Jun 05, 2013
Posts: 107
Location: Ohio (zone 6; just west of Lake Erie)
    
    1
Jami McBride wrote:There is chewable melatonin that tastes like peppermint.  The brand is Nutrition Now, I get it in the health food island at Fred Meyers.  It relaxes and clams, it is not a drug.  I had friends give it to their hyper son just to take the edge off. 

Also running the child during the day, and giving him a warm bath just before bed to settle down for the evening.

But none of this will work if the parents are busy, the house is noisy, lights are on - all things signaling that the fun stuff is still going on.  No one likes to be left out of what's going on.

When my kids were young I would shut off most of the lights, sometimes light a candle, give them their daily bath and then let them watch a movie - worked every time, they were out before the movie was over.  I was also sitting quietly reading or watching the show.  No noise or activity, everything (the house and me) signaled the day was over time for bed.


I'll second what Jami wrote (except for the melatonin -- because I don't know anything about it). Having a peaceful and dimly lit evening plus a relaxing bedtime routine are great ideas. We cherish our family's bedtime routine which includes reading stories in bed for about a half an hour. My boys are 8, 6, and 4 and they love listening to stories as they fall asleep. Bonds of love and attachment are created especially during this time.
David Livingston
pollinator

Joined: Apr 24, 2013
Posts: 841
Location: Anjou ,France
    
  27
My mother used to give me " gripe water" but later on discovered it contained a greater % of alcohol than whiskey . But it worked

David


Living in Anjou , France
Dawn Hoff


Joined: Jun 30, 2013
Posts: 226
Location: Andalucía, Spain
    
    1
It isn't natural for babies or toddlers to sleep through the night - it is an expectation that is entirely western and sets western parents up for failure (and makes them feel that they have to use methods like cry-it-out to make their babies comply with the norm). Most babies sleep better in their mothers arms, and most babies in the west are made to sleep alone.

Other than that - yes TV and computers disrupt your natural sleep rusted and inhibits natural production of melatonin. Turning it off at least one hour before bedtime might help. Many children (and adults) lack magnesium in their diets and this is also leads to disrupted sleep (because muscle relaxation requires magnesium). My daughter had what looked like "night terrors" many many nights until I stated giving her bone broth and Epsom salt baths (not every night but a few nights per week).
alisha cornog


Joined: Dec 24, 2013
Posts: 2
@ Elissa...I tried co_sleeping and it doesn't work. He tries to fall of the bed and I even put tons of pillows and blankets to soften the blow and he moves around like crazy and still wakes up at night. I cant give him melatonin because he's to young. im lost for words on what to do to help him sleep at night. I feel so bad that he cant fall and stay asleep.
Dale Hodgins
pollinator

Joined: Jul 28, 2011
Posts: 3816
Location: Victoria British Columbia-Canada
    
  53
Paul will be happy to note that once again, the villain may be those damn CFL bulbs. Their attempt to mimic sunlight causes the brain to think it's the middle of the day as bedtime approaches. Old fashioned incandescents throw more light in the red and infrared zone. Sunsets and campfires have more light at that end of the spectrum. Seratonin levels may be at the root of this.

This probably has more to do with getting to sleep than with staying asleep, but either way, let's ditch those bulbs. They're killing the kids !!!


QUOTES FROM MEMBERS --- In my veterinary opinion, pets should be fed the diet they are biologically designed to eat. Su Ba...The "redistribution" aspect is an "Urban Myth" as far as I know. I have only heard it uttered by those who do not have a food forest, and are unlikely to create one. John Polk ...Even as we sit here, wondering what to do, soil fungi are degrading the chemicals that were applied. John Elliott ... O.K., I originally came to Permies to talk about Rocket Mass Heaters RMHs, and now I have less and less time in my life, and more and more Good People to Help ! Al Lumley...I think with the right use of permie principles, most of Wyoming could be turned into a paradise. Miles Flansburg... Then you must do the pig's work. Sepp Holzer
 
 
subject: Toddler won't sleep through the night
 
cast iron skillet 49er

more from paul wheaton's glorious empire of web junk: cast iron skillet diatomaceous earth sepp holzer raised garden beds raising chickens lawn care flea control missoula electric heaters permaculture videos permaculture books