permaculture magazine*
Permies likes trees and the farmer likes Growing coffee in cold climates without a greenhouse permies
  Search | Permaculture Wiki | Recent Topics | Flagged Topics | Hot Topics | Zero Replies
Register / Login


(the sound is wonky for the first 20 seconds)

daily-ish email

micro heaters

rocket mass heater

wofati

permies » forums » growies » trees
Bookmark "Growing coffee in cold climates without a greenhouse" Watch "Growing coffee in cold climates without a greenhouse" New topic
Author

Growing coffee in cold climates without a greenhouse

Adrien Lapointe
steward

Joined: Feb 23, 2012
Posts: 2205
Location: Kingston, Canada (USDA zone 5a)
    
  56
I am reading reading Mark Shepard's book, Restoration Agriculture, right now and he suggests that growing tropical plants in the North is possible using a mass breeding technique (Luther Burbank style).

As anybody aware of people doing that right now in North America?


Permaculture Kingston
Miles Flansburg
steward

Joined: Feb 03, 2011
Posts: 1889
Location: Zones 2-4 Wyoming and 4-5 Colorado
    
  41
I had to look him up Adrien.

http://www.genetics.org/content/158/4/1391.full

Sounds like if one studies enough and tries enough things one might make it work ?
R Scott


Joined: Apr 13, 2012
Posts: 1829
Location: Kansas Zone 6a
    
  19
IWe do mass selection as part of our seedsaving, but never knew to call it that.

I am on a quest for caffeine, as soon as my food forest gets established. But I haven't started coffee yet. A friend has, but he has a pretty special microclimate already--15 miles away but a COMPLETELY different growing world.


"You must be the change you want to see in the world." "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." --Mahatma Gandhi
"Preach the Gospel always, and if necessary, use words." --Francis of Assisi. "Family farms work when the whole family works the farm." -- Adam Klaus
Ben Walter


Joined: Mar 19, 2011
Posts: 89
Location: Deland, FL
    
    1
If the coffee doesn't work for you, check out yaupon holly (Ilex Vomitoria). It's very high in caffeine!
Alder Burns
pollinator

Joined: Feb 25, 2012
Posts: 786
Location: northern California
    
  20
Ordinary black tea (Camellia sinensis) might be less of a stretch....there are varieties hardy at least to zone 7B, whereas coffee is frost-tender I think. Tea tolerates part shade and being a shrub would be a good understory plant in a food forest type system. Remember it is native in a monsoon climate and will want reliable summer moisture (but without waterlogging) to produce well.


Alder Burns (adiantum)
Adrien Lapointe
steward

Joined: Feb 23, 2012
Posts: 2205
Location: Kingston, Canada (USDA zone 5a)
    
  56
Actually, a very well known Montréal gardening writer has reported having success with Camellia sinensis surviving winter in his garden on the south shore of Montréal.
Amedean Messan
pollinator

Joined: Nov 11, 2010
Posts: 703
Location: Burlington, NC - Woodland, Clay - Zone 7
    
  22
Alder Burns wrote:Ordinary black tea (Camellia sinensis) might be less of a stretch....there are varieties hardy at least to zone 7B, whereas coffee is frost-tender I think. Tea tolerates part shade and being a shrub would be a good understory plant in a food forest type system. Remember it is native in a monsoon climate and will want reliable summer moisture (but without waterlogging) to produce well.


This is true and I have one growing by the side of my house. So far it has stood up to this winter decent here in NC and we will see how well it will grow this spring.


Those who hammer their swords into plows will plow for those who don't!
osker brown


Joined: Jun 28, 2011
Posts: 146
Location: Southern Appalachia
There's a guy right down the road from me growing tea, this is in zone 6b. His plan is to use it as an understory for chinese chestnut.

peace


Glorious Forest Farm
David Goodman
volunteer

Joined: Dec 14, 2011
Posts: 322
Location: Zone 9a/8b
    
  13
Wow - awesome.

Yaupon holly is a good source (actually - the only source) for native caffeine, though it may not grow as far north as you are. I've done a plant profile on it at my own website because I too am a caffeine junkie. It's a good tea - I make it moderately often. I don't know if coffee possesses anything in its genes for cold-hardiness. That's a big stretch, but I always love experiments.

In TN, I know of a man who was growing lemon trees - no lie - in his backyard. He'd been throwing seeds in the ground for years. They don't even thrive in zone 8, normally... and this was 6a/7b. They were living and growing to multiple feet at the time I was there, but no fruit yet. Awesome.


Permaculture, bio-accumulators, rare plants, tool reviews and lots and lots of gardening inspiration - a new post every day: http://www.floridasurvivalgardening.com
Amedean Messan
pollinator

Joined: Nov 11, 2010
Posts: 703
Location: Burlington, NC - Woodland, Clay - Zone 7
    
  22
David Goodman wrote:Wow - awesome.

In TN, I know of a man who was growing lemon trees - no lie - in his backyard. He'd been throwing seeds in the ground for years. They don't even thrive in zone 8, normally... and this was 6a/7b. They were living and growing to multiple feet at the time I was there, but no fruit yet. Awesome.


David, I am very, very......very very interested in this guy you are speaking of.
David Goodman
volunteer

Joined: Dec 14, 2011
Posts: 322
Location: Zone 9a/8b
    
  13
I wish I knew how to find him.

Here's the whole story. One day, a gentleman from a local Methodist church was going door-to-door in my neighborhood in Smyrna, TN, sharing the Gospel and inviting people to his church. I was out back working on my garden, and since I was a fellow Christian, I ended up chatting with the fellow for a while, talking about his church, etc. We got talking gardening (because I always end up talking about that), and I mentioned that I missed growing tropical species.

He said, "Oh man... you know what? I know a guy here that grows lemons in his backyard."

Me: "No way! HOW?"

"He's just been planting seeds for years and letting them live or die. In fact, he'd probably give you one. Also - you want some bee balm? I've got some of that."

Me: "Sure!"

The man left, then some hours later came back with a 2' lemon tree seedling and some bee balm. I planted the tree against my back wall and hoped for the best.

Unfortunately, I later lost most of that backyard to the Nashville flood... totally had my gardens, mulch, years worth of built-up soil, etc., ripped away by a raging torrent of water from an overflowing drainage channel. After that, totally demoralized, I listed the house and left for Florida. It's been four years - I imagine the new owners mowed over the little seedling, provided it hadn't died. And I don't know the man's name - it was the only time I ever saw him - and I have no idea who was growing the trees.

Looking back on it, I kick myself. Stupid. If the story of the trees' cold tolerance was true, it's a loss to everyone. I wasn't nearly as smart on these things back then.

I so utterly wish I could tell you more.

Amedean Messan
pollinator

Joined: Nov 11, 2010
Posts: 703
Location: Burlington, NC - Woodland, Clay - Zone 7
    
  22
His method of seeding is consistent with developing cold hardy strains so he might have hit the genetic lottery. Well, if you have not severed any connections and have some passing time, please do some investigating and share the intel. Thanks.
David Goodman
volunteer

Joined: Dec 14, 2011
Posts: 322
Location: Zone 9a/8b
    
  13
Though I don't think I'll be able to find the mysterious lemon grower again, I can tell you what I'm doing here in North Florida.

For a few years now I've been growing papaya trees, then saving seeds from those that survive the frosts and go to fruit. I'm also planting a lot of citrus seeds and seeing what happens. We're at the top of the range for quite a few varieties. Over time, I might find something good.

I also have a coffee plant in my greenhouse that's about to bloom. That'll give me plenty of coffee beans to try.

I'll bet there are marginal coffee plantations in South America that see some frost and survive. Those farmers would be the ones to talk with. Field trip!
Bobby Clark Jr


Joined: Jan 01, 2013
Posts: 7
Location: Lamar County Mississippi
Many years ago I was remodeling a house in Athens Tenn. and they had lemons growing their yard that had been bearing for a long time, good lemonade! I took some seedlings home to the top of Cagle mtn. in Sequatchie county but never got fruit. The Myeres Improved Lemon is supposed to be frost hardy and I have one here in Miss. but in the greenhouse so far. I plan to try coffee here also, both inside and out.
Dyson Frost


Joined: Jan 08, 2012
Posts: 4
Interesting topic. Middle NC south of VA border area so what about planting citrus, coffee, tea etc. and then covering with a hoop house in cold times? Strip the plastic rest of the year etc. Would heat be necessary? If so what about a modified rocket thermal mass system? thanks for any advice...
Adrien Lapointe
steward

Joined: Feb 23, 2012
Posts: 2205
Location: Kingston, Canada (USDA zone 5a)
    
  56
Well the greenhouse method is pretty efficient, but I am more interested in the idea of growing the plants completely outside.
Dyson Frost


Joined: Jan 08, 2012
Posts: 4
Yes I know that is the main thread heading however a part greenhouse method may work for some.

Do share any varieties you find. Finding your own cold-hardy version through trial and error will take time. Yaupon holly you say?
 
 
subject: Growing coffee in cold climates without a greenhouse
 
Similar Threads
Blackcap Raspberries (Rubus occidentalis) ripening now
spiky fungus
Transition to sustainable living
Erosion Control Plants for a North Facing Wooded Slope
As the World Burns, a derrick jensen novel
cast iron skillet 49er

more from paul wheaton's glorious empire of web junk: cast iron skillet diatomaceous earth sepp holzer raised garden beds raising chickens lawn care flea control missoula electric heaters permaculture videos permaculture books