<![CDATA[permies: Latest posts for the topic "Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design"]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/t/117/hugelkultur/Interesting-keyhole-hugelkultur-design JForum - http://www.jforum.net Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design

I came across this in our electric co-op's newsletter. The designer doesn't mention anything about permaculture/hugel/etc. but uses many similar ideas to make a pretty interesting little ecosystem. She says this performs very well in our current drought. Click here for the article and here for the designer's site with a pdf.

While I'm not crazy about the cemented rock wall around the outside, I think this is a pretty cool implementation of multiple practices all boxed up together in a small, productive unit. She also does it in old boats, various kinds of containers.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112750 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112750 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design

]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112758 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112758 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112882 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112882 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykCXfjzfaco. The above article and pictures are a souped up version of the African keyhole beds in the video. I'm surprised because I was trying to think of ways to improve upon Hemenway's keyhole beds to make them more drought tolerant a year ago and I never came across these!]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112883 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112883 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112903 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112903 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design

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I believe this deserves a trial ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112916 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112916 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Chris Dean wrote:Todd -- I wonder too if that works, or how well it works. I'm inclined to believe it works great because of the origin--I don't think Africans in poverty would waste materials and time on things they didn't know to work, but this might not be accurate thinking. (a note after writing that: not meaning to assume that Africans or even those in the video are automatically in poverty. The video comes from a charity organization that teaches people in poverty to grow a garden with materials they have, hence my connection.)

I believe this deserves a trial


Totally agree it needs a trial. I was just trying to think it through. It could work simply because the original materials act much like a standard hugelkultur. The idea of the central tower flowing into the circle is brilliant. Again, just not sure how it could work. Though as Tyler says, it maybe worms or mushrooms or something. Most of the annuals I grow, except maybe tomatoes, don't seem to have root systems that long. Maybe they have a longer growing season so there's more time for root growth?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112920 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112920 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
i'm reminded of an old Organic Gardening magazine design my dad did years ago. it involved a wire compost bin in the center of a garden bed with plants surrounding it. the outside bed wasn't built up as much though. this was maybe 25 yrs ago
to irrigate, water was dumped into the center, flushing the nutrients to the outside. it grew great tomatoes. the roots found their way inside, they were trellised around and over top of the cage]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112996 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/112996 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design cob (pretty rough cob--it wasn't "perfectly" mixed), the bottom is filled with logs for hugelkulture, with some broken down newspaper and such here and there. I ran a soaker hose under the top layer and planted some cover crop that hasn't come up yet. Looking forward to growing in it!!


]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116854 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116854 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116874 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116874 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Roman Milford wrote:Wouldn't the compost "basket" soon clog up, plus there would minimal airflow, right?


i think it becomes more of a 'feeder' for worms and soil critters , not like an aerobic hot compost pile. looks like a natural version of the in-bed "worm towers" made of pvc pipe/5gal buckets.
]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116879 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116879 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116977 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/116977 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
for beds not within immediate range of the house, one could replace the compost tube with a stump innoculated with mushroom spores to add edible mushrooms to the bed, it might also make a good asparagus bed eh?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/117529 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/117529 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
I've never tried anything with mushrooms, only read a very little bit. Would the lack of oxygen be a problem?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/117797 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/117797 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
short answer, i think it depends on mushroom variety but i would say, generally speaking, no.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118088 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118088 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design trees out in the back yard, as well as raising the canopy of an old Elm we have in the north west corner of the yard. Half of the wood I will have chipped. A quarter I will mix into the bed, a quarter will make great mulch for my walkways and raspberries, and I will store the rest in containers by the bed for carbon contributions atop garden waste that will go into the plugged channels on the bed's perimeter. Eventually, the channels will all be filled, and the pallets will rot away, but by that time the perennial food shrubs and cane berries and maybe dwarf fruit trees will replace their structure with a thick root mat. I hadn't thought of making it in the shape of the keyhole bed, though. I will play with that idea. That and innoculating my hugelkultur bed with some compatible mushroom strain. Any thoughts?

-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118261 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118261 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118265 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118265 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118294 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118294 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Devon Olsen wrote:also, chris dean, hows your beds coming, anything growing up and out yet?

I'm gone from home for a week and got someone to do some occasional watering, but when I left there were sprouts from the cover crop coming up. Will get some pictures up of it when I get back!]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118310 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/118310 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design I haven't watered this bed yet except a sprinkling when I planted them, but we've gotten about 1.5 inches of rain in the last 2 weeks. Planning on this being a tomato bed this year.


]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/119860 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/119860 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design it does look pretty good with some green though i still feel(not sure if i mentioned this before) that it may look better if there wasn't dirt/cob(if thats what that is) showing between the rock, if i were designing it for someone else or for a place that i may sell down the road i would probably avoid that myself, but its still works just as good i woud assume...]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/119861 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/119861 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Devon Olsen wrote:it may look better if there wasn't dirt/cob(if thats what that is) showing between the rock


That's surprising! My wife and I love the look of cob, and I actually got hired to build a taller bed made of rock and cob for someone who saw this pic! A good thing about the cob instead of cement is it will be cooler in the summer.

To each his own ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120198 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120198 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design i definately wouldn't put cememnt between the rocks or anything... and it could be that cob looks better than simply stacking the rocks when in person
i do think that the cob would look amazing if your were near a pine forest or anything, if you were trying to give a straight natural look, i was thinking that in most suburban yards it may look better without the cob though, as cleaner looks prevail in these environments imo
i am building one of these this summer with a large stump in the middle... we'll see what i decide to do with it]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120207 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120207 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
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Devon Olsen wrote:interesting indeed!
i definately wouldn't put cememnt between the rocks or anything... and it could be that cob looks better than simply stacking the rocks when in person
i do think that the cob would look amazing if your were near a pine forest or anything, if you were trying to give a straight natural look, i was thinking that in most suburban yards it may look better without the cob though, as cleaner looks prevail in these environments imo
i am building one of these this summer with a large stump in the middle... we'll see what i decide to do with it


Good point--and the person who is hiring me lives out in the country I have seen these built without any kind of mortar at all though, just the rocks or bricks stacked. Any kind of masonry bricks would look good in a suburban setting, and you could put them up in no time.

@Tyler--Ollas indeed! I made them last year but didn't get them in the ground, so this year I will hopefully get them in and experiment with them. I procrastinate because of the holes that need to be dug Have you had any experience with them?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120246 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120246 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design

]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120247 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120247 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design and yes digging, sucks]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120262 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120262 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
If rocks are a pain to source, standard landscaping bricks (that overlap the back of each row below) would be very sturdy and seemingly perfect for something like this.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120269 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120269 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design ). I'd go as cheap as possible, but if the wall was tied into the bed with brick ties or built so it corbels (I think that's the word) back row on top of row 1/8" to 1/4" depending on bed height, you could likely use tumbled pavers (much cheaper) or brick you salvage yourself, though depending on where it comes from, I would be wary of toxicity. I like the idea of using masonry to side the beds, as they should hold more heat longer than just dirt alone, and prevent unwanted erosion.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120272 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120272 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
I'm using those concrete landscaping blocks to create a low bed all around my house, and they end up with lots of little spaces and gaps... nice for little niches of "rock gardening" plants and for little critters to get in and out.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120274 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120274 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120276 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120276 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120278 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120278 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120282 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120282 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Devon Olsen wrote:what are ollas?
and yes digging, sucks


Check out this link to see diy ollas that you don't have to dig such a deep hole for!]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120341 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120341 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120359 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120359 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
amarlover Hatfield wrote:could we replace the centre with bamboo (pushed thru w pipe etc) or a PVC pipe w holes or drainage pipe w holes?


The center is meant to be a container for compost for earthworms and other organisms. My understanding is you only want enough material encircling this part to keep it together while you're building the bed. Once the bed is built the dirt surrounding the center will be its support. I would stick to using only stuff that is organic matter--saplings wrapped around the center posts, jute twine, stuff like that which will break down and add nutrients to the bed.

I used cedar fenceposts to encircle it because they won't break down as quickly--I intend to connect some kind of arch from the edge of the bed to these posts to use as vining support to provide shade in the heat of the summer.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120443 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120443 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120482 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120482 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Just wondering though weather you could use the cob in the walls to grow more stuff, like strawberries? Mite help keep things even cooler as well.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120494 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120494 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120502 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/120502 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/122236 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/122236 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
This is a really interesting idea. I've been using hugelkultur beds for a few years now and I've also been experimenting with vericomposting trenches as well. This seems like a great way to combine to two. In winter, you could insulate the whole thing with straw or something similar and allow the worms to overwinter. I think I'm going to build something like this. I love gardening experiments!]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/125230 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/125230 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design and that sounds like an awesome experiment, let us know how it goes and take plenty of pics when you do]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/125336 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/125336 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design tomatoes in it, a squash with too much shade that's still doing well, and potatoes and sweet potatoes coming up from leftovers in the center composting area. On the south side I also have basil and oregano.

Some things I've learned
1. I should have faced the keyhole part to the south to maximize sun for everybody. This wasn't a dealbreaker though because everything seems quite content and is growing quickly.
2. This is a glorified, round hugelkultur. I'm not sure that the compost in the center is really that big a deal--this is producing as well as my other hugel beds.
3. Aesthetically, these are really nice. Still I prefer long raised beds. These are a lot of work and you can only make them so big because you need to be able to reach into the middle. I am building one more because I can't fit a long bed in one place in the yard. These would be nice for urban gardens where you care about what the yard looks like (we live out in the country). I threw ours together but it can be made a little more attractive quite easily.

The wood I used in the bottom had been buried for a year and then was dug up to put into this bed, so this may not be typical of a first year with fresh wood.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/132673 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/132673 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
or if using cobb, make it a chia pet !]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/132707 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/132707 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/133020 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/133020 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design

]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/133023 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/133023 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design I'm looking to put keyholes in different areas of my yard. Being in central Texas in a perpetual drought with 100 degree temps, am looking to put some keyholes underneath some crepe myrtles near my shop (where they will provide some partial shade certain times during the day). Have enough rocks around to provide the border, and want to plant butternut squash, malabar spinach (is in the bed to the left now, so will have to re-transplant). Malabar spinach is great for our climate, and grows pretty steadily as a vine. May put in some thyme along the rocks as someone mentioned. May add some beans to promote nitrogen. Oh course will be adding tree limbs, cardboard and such.

Any ideas for other edibles that could grow well in our area in a keyhole would be welcome.
May even try some asparagus and other perennials.
Other spot is by my shop where I'm thinking of putting a rectangle shaped keyhole-ish bed or a wicking bed.
]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/145769 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/145769 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
My tomatoes are producing well in my keyhole. They do look very very sad because of the heat, but I think some partial shading would help that (thinking about building something over the bed for vines next year). With the tomatoes I have basil and Mexican oregano, both happy.

Do remember regarding our "perpetual drought"--very wet years are possible. Where I am we had 40 inches about 5 years ago, and then of course 10 last year. Just be careful that you don't over accomodate for dry spells so that plants suffer in the wet years.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/145790 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/145790 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Chris Dean wrote:Here's the update for this African keyhole bed. I have 6 very happy tomatoes in it, a squash with too much shade that's still doing well, and potatoes and sweet potatoes coming up from leftovers in the center composting area. On the south side I also have basil and oregano.

Some things I've learned
1. I should have faced the keyhole part to the south to maximize sun for everybody. This wasn't a dealbreaker though because everything seems quite content and is growing quickly.
2. This is a glorified, round hugelkultur. I'm not sure that the compost in the center is really that big a deal--this is producing as well as my other hugel beds.
3. Aesthetically, these are really nice. Still I prefer long raised beds. These are a lot of work and you can only make them so big because you need to be able to reach into the middle. I am building one more because I can't fit a long bed in one place in the yard. These would be nice for urban gardens where you care about what the yard looks like (we live out in the country). I threw ours together but it can be made a little more attractive quite easily.

The wood I used in the bottom had been buried for a year and then was dug up to put into this bed, so this may not be typical of a first year with fresh wood.


Beautiful keyhole garden.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/145794 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/145794 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182071 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182071 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
I find that some climates benefit from design tweaking. I'm a big fan of those small unfired clay jugs that you bury up to the necks in your bed or garden or planter/pot whatever. You water the jug, and everything else if it's that dry, and the clay releases moisture through the sides of the jug to hydrate the surrounding soil as it dries, a low-tech time-release capsule.
If you can commit to keeping it moist enough, I would make sure you have enough worms in your soil. They do well to condition it so that it holds more moisture.

Even with the increase of moisture in recent years, we do end up with three months with very little rain in the summer, so I do deal with the same issue.

I am using 2'x3.5' skids to make my beds this year. I will get up pics of last year's remnants that I will incorporate into the new one, and post pics of during and after as well as soon as it thaws enough to break ground.

-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182081 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182081 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182187 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182187 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
I have looked at the idea of the clay water things, but never felt I could spend the money it would take to put one every foot or two in the beds to try to keep the beds moist enough. (It really dries out fast here--the soil can feel moist at 7 am and be dry as a bone by noon! And raised beds are the worst for this, so now I am focusing on putting in sunken beds. A little harder to work around, but at least the soil and mulch stay put.

I have tried mulching my raised beds, only to see all the mulch blow away in the next wind event. I did succeed in holding mulch on one bed, last year, by covering the mulch with a layer of sticks--but by the time the corn got big enough to hold the mulch, the sticks were so entertwined that I couldn't pull them out until after the corn harvest. So I am still looking for answers and trying new things all the time.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182252 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182252 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design


This is an other one which I'll plant up this year :




]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182264 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182264 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design absolutely beautiful to me, would love to do something like that in a yard/property a little out of the way - might not look too great in town but not like that matters to me if im not living in town, just awesome work though

the second one i bet will look good if you have some plants using it as a trellis, greenery contrasted with weaved wood like that would look cool i think]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182383 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/182383 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
The shape of the bed increases edge (due to the wings / spokes) and it will hopefully act as a deer deterrent too, as they don't like grazing in places where their vision is obscured like it is here.

The bed is hopefully going to be built in Northern Canada so I've shaped it like this to create micro climates (the biggest in the middle obviously).

Thoughts?

p.s. excuse my total lack of artistic talent ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184516 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184516 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184517 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184517 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
I keep waking up with ideas, too. One idea I have had recently is to make a swale, on contour, and then, just below the swale, make some u-shaped berms, like scallops on a piece of lace. I would scoop out the center of each berm, to make the berm higher, and fill in the center with wood to form a woody terrace. I figure if I plant one fruit tree, with associated guild plants, on each terrace, the swale above and the terrace and berm could help to collect and hold water for the plants.

This idea came, I think, from noticing that scooped out depressions along the highway seem to hold the snow longer and collect rain, and are actually supporting trees, in a barren landscape that is mostly desert scrub and thinly scattered bunch grass otherwise.

Spring is coming! We have been experiencing a bit warmer weather for several days, so the snow is starting to melt. I still have 1 to 2 feet of snow on most of my garden, but several spots where I had piled up sand or formed berms, or where we shoveled paths, are clear now. Yea.

As part of my site analysis, I am watching to see where the snow melts first. So now, after what I am seeing, I have decided to build some higher berms, and add OM on the south facing slopes, to give an area that will hopefully warm up and start growing a bit sooner.]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184524 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184524 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184530 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184530 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184534 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184534 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design cob pets?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184674 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184674 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184687 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184687 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184743 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/184743 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
I got the go ahead to place one of these on the church grounds to grow food as a community service (we'll give the food to the local food banks, etc)

All I need to do is find a source of wood, soil, and earth moving equipment for free.

Any ideas?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186337 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186337 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Irene Kightley wrote:This is one of ours surrounded by tree roots dug up by the pigs. It's about four years old now and I only have to water when I plant :



This is an other one which I'll plant up this year :






Interesting, Irene- the first bed combines hugelkultur with stumpery design- fun I'm having some fun going through your blog and flickr pics ..]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186346 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186346 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design urine) at need, with blood meal being a close second in places where disposing of conspicuous jugs of yellow liquid might prove problematic. If you have the leisure of time, I suppose you could use a ground-cover that was comprised of mainly nitrogen-fixers and bioaccumulators with deep or extensive (or both) root systems.

What are you planning on planting?

-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186392 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186392 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186395 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186395 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design organic nitrogen to add.

-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186402 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186402 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design I'm more likely to keep that sort of material as mulch/pathway coverings etc, or at the layer immediately on top of wood, rather than mixing it into the main rooting zone anyway.
Seems like it might be a good idea to get some rotted manure from my neighbours anyway for the first year or two. I don't mind doing some setup of beds that could take a couple of years to mature, but I do want some immediate gratification areas for annual vegetables...]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186408 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186408 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186416 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186416 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design Also a fair bit of leaves and some longer grass that can be raked, so I should find lots of stuff, plus grass clippings in summer.
I have some piles of barkey stuff that has sat for a couple of years, so there is some good black stuff in there, still lots of unbroken down woody bits too, though...
Here's one of the areas I'm planning to do something:
http://www.permies.com/t/22904/forest-garden/Project-Existing-Open-Woodland-Alberta]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186419 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186419 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design organic input. If its something that you think would work, you could turn the whole hugelbeet into an opportunistic vermiculture operation. All you would have to do would be design for a couple or more tubes of some sort (I like square towers built of crossing pairs of branch sections, or unfired clay tubes) to provide chutes for your donated kitchen scraps and some of those wood chips that go right to the heart of the pile, and puts the resultant worm castings right in the root zone. The worms will just migrate to the fresh food. You could even sneak some BSFL into one of the tubes. While worms generally don't like the enzymes related to the presence of the actual larvae, they love larvae leavings. It's like prepping your worm feed.

Don't know how far you'll be willing or allowed to go, but good luck.

-CK]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186432 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186432 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design mouse explosion , it would be no problem getting some. (there are already lots of mice and voles, the hay would give them excellent shelter; we have one part-time outdoor cat, but he is too busy patrolling the property for the neighbour's cats to hunt much anymore..lol..this is very dangerous country for cats, so I will absolutely not be getting any more outdoor cats)
The worm tube idea is interesting, something I will need to look into more..]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186510 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186510 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Chris Kott wrote:Nick, where are you situated? If I was doing what you are where I am, I'd be calling arbourists (I don't know what else you'd call tree people) for wood chips (preferably only chips from branches less than 3" in diameter, more inner bark, with its starches and minerals in plant food form, resulting in less need for nitrogen to break down and less to no nitrogen draw-down) and the larger logs (much more harder-to-digest lignin). I've been reading recently that if you use chips that are primarily inner bark (they call these smaller branches ramial wood), you can easily manage a 50/50 soil/chip mix with no major issues (although I have heard a lot about the judicious application of LHF (liquid human fertilizer, or urine) at need, with blood meal being a close second in places where disposing of conspicuous jugs of yellow liquid might prove problematic. If you have the leisure of time, I suppose you could use a ground-cover that was comprised of mainly nitrogen-fixers and bioaccumulators with deep or extensive (or both) root systems.

What are you planning on planting?

-CK


I'm located in Thunder Bay, Ontario.

I've heard Paul Wheaton go on and on about hugel beds made from wood chips providing the perfect mega farm for pill bugs. I'm planning on doing it with solid wood logs. By the time I practically get this bed constructed, it'll be too late in this growing season so Nitrogen draw down is not a huge deal. I'm planning on planting a lot of legumes in the mound as well.

There's a new sub division going in nearby this summer and they'll be bulldozing mature forest for this so getting some wood might not be too problematic. I'll need to find out what they do with the excess soil too come to think of it...

]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186522 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186522 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design A plan for further future development of a domed green house in the middle would be pretty sweet : )

Also I responded to your thread on seed sources for your project here http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/reply/0/22309]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186595 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186595 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design humanure directly? As long as the bed contains the right plants and is stacked stone/urbanite, the emptied humanure is covered with cover material...could this work? A high surrounding bed would hide the central tube contents and keep the high nitrogen bottom material from burning roots, while providing airflow to the bed. Any ideas?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186679 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186679 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design
Jennifer Jennings wrote:Has anyone thought of doing this using a slightly larger hollow central core for composting humanure directly? As long as the bed contains the right plants and is stacked stone/urbanite, the emptied humanure is covered with cover material...could this work? A high surrounding bed would hide the central tube contents and keep the high nitrogen bottom material from burning roots, while providing airflow to the bed. Any ideas?


That's kinda the direction that I have been planning, but not with direct humanure. I really think, you want at least 1 year composted and I, myself, will take it a bit further and Bokashi process, before composting. Making the keyhole concept larger, utilizing the keyhole design as a single part and multiplying into full or partial mandala(s). Plenty of wood in the bottom, lasagna-layering with composted humanure & vermicompost, urine/LAB innoculated bio-char and a good concentration of Forest Bacteria & Fungi, chop & drop and soil. I think, the size of the central keyhole feeding core would somewhere between 24-30", maybe it could be dual-chambered, so the inside tube/chamber could accept the humanure, outer tube/sleeve would be for Bokashi, compost, whatever... ]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186689 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186689 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design humanure. The outer core could prevent leaching in a heavy rain, and with a lid on the central core, I doubt you'd get much leaching at all. Throw some red worms in there and it may be all good - and no need to have composting piles, which would remove one more step in the process. Am I wrong in my thinking, anyone?]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186783 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186783 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design humanure composting, using bales of straw or old hay around the piles, to help insulate from the winter cold and absorb any run-off moisture. These curved mounds would also require a lot more space to work around them, I think.

Nick, the more I think about it, the more I like your design. A few weeks ago I actually started drawing out a similar curved berm design to protect a winter chicken coop from cold winds and, with boards and clear or opaque fiberglass panels,from the roof of the coop to the top of the berm, create a "greenhouse" of sorts for a winter chicken forage yard. (My 'girls' were forced to spend the last 3 or 4 months cooped up in our sunken greenhouse when the snow got so deep it covered up their access door. Now the snow is gone and they are enjoying the freedom of their fenced run again. But I am trying to plan something better to be ready for the next winter.)]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186982 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/186982 Interesting keyhole/hugelkultur design humanure, does flatten out and compress rather quickly - even more so when the worms get in there - so I don't know that the core really has to be that big, especially if you have several of these beds to space out your compost deposits.

Your curved berm chicken run sounds really interesting - please post pics of the sketches!]]> http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/187187 http://www.permies.com/forums/posts/preList/12429/187187