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women peeing outdoors

                                


Joined: Mar 20, 2011
Posts: 33
This thread is what lead me to join this forum!

I live in a pretty green minded city, but I still live in a huge apartment complex.
Peeing outdoors for me would cause probably a few heart attacks and most likely an eviction.

However! There are no holds barred when I go camping or am pregnant!
Skirts help a lot as I am one of the few women who find underwear to be a nuisance and just another item to have to wash

My 4yr old freaked out when she caught my Previous BF watering his yard.
But Momma.... He just PEEE' outside!!!
"Well sweetheart, sometimes Boys like to mark their territory"  

I waited about two minutes before I reminded her that next camping trip there won't be a "potty". She's still freaking out about this weeks later 
Bull norris


Joined: Feb 03, 2011
Posts: 50
Location: Chanute Kansas
With my 2 girls 7and 9 , 1 can pee on the run and the other OMG has to make sure everthing is just right. Princesess potty only nothing better be out of place.
 
                          


Joined: Mar 27, 2011
Posts: 56
Location: Bremerton, Washington
All I can say is that peeing outside would be a lot more fun if I had a nozzle to squirt through like men do.  I might be okay with it if I could shake it clean.  I simply am not built for such things.

As it is, I would avoid peeing "au naturale" if at ALL possible.  I would be disgusted to have even a drop of pee staining my clothes. 

That being said, it isn't the fact of being outdoors that bothers me.  An outdoor fascility could be very nice, such as a well-built humanure toilet.  If I were going camping, though, and knew I had to use the naked forest, I would bring along some toilet paper and a small ceramic milk jug.  You know, the kind that used to hold about a quart of milk for the family's breakfast.  It's shape is perfect for cupping the vulva, the handle is convenient, and the capacity is enough not to fear overflowing nor to be too cumbersome.  I have used such things on many occasions when I wanted to collect my urine to fertilize my garden or help break down straw in compost.

A simple wipe for me and a quick rinse for the jug, and everything is fine.  Certainly saves more water than a flush toilet!
                          


Joined: Apr 20, 2011
Posts: 10
Location: Rural North Central Indiana
I have a different reason for not wanting to pee outside. I am older and on several meds that I really don't want to take a chance and spread outside, especially in the garden. javascript:replaceText('%20',%20document.postmodify.message);


Facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000550273606 with pictures of our homestead.
Mary Saunders


Joined: Nov 26, 2010
Posts: 73
If you flush it away with drinking water though, it gets in a river, where it is likely more hurtful to fish than if a plant or fungi on land uses it.  It is very difficult to get pharmaceuticals out of water, while there is a chance on-land life could de-tox it.  Digitoxin, for example, comes from plants in the first place.
                          


Joined: Apr 20, 2011
Posts: 10
Location: Rural North Central Indiana
Ours goes to a septic tank. I'm hoping to get healthier and not have to take as many meds. But until that time, i'll just run inside. We are hoping to build a couple of composting toilets around the property. This alternative would be acceptable to me since you could determine where it winds up.
                                  


Joined: Mar 18, 2011
Posts: 7
Location: Missouri
I am curious Grandma as to where these meds do end up?  Perhaps in the community drinking  water?
Even in a septic filed  might they not end up in the aquifer?

Can you win for losing? Inquiring minds want to know!   


Somewhere in Missouri
Mary Saunders


Joined: Nov 26, 2010
Posts: 73
Above-ground composting is best for preventing the chemicals getting in an aquifer.  Plants and fungi are likely to take care of it first.
                                  


Joined: Mar 18, 2011
Posts: 7
Location: Missouri
I agree that regardless of the efficacy - that the composting idea is probably the the best idea if you are going to take these drugs.

I am not an expert in this field but I would not be surprised if some things did not break down nor surprised of other compounds
did make it to the aquifer.  After all even the water companies do not seem able to filter them from the municipal water supplies.


For myself the answer I came up with long, long ago was not to take any of the poisons distributed by the allopathic<sp> witch doctors. There is almost always a  nutritional approach that cures conditions that does not involve taking drugs to cover up and mask symptoms. I do this to protect my body not the water supply but I guess that is an added benefit. 

Good for you grandma for looking into getting off of these poisons!




                          


Joined: Apr 20, 2011
Posts: 10
Location: Rural North Central Indiana
our septic system has never needed to be emptied, so it stays in the tank. Not ideal either but it is what we have for now.
                                  


Joined: Mar 18, 2011
Posts: 7
Location: Missouri
Hi grandma!

All septic systems  that I am aware of have leech fields.  You pump out your tank to prevent the solids from building up and getting into the leech field drain tiles. If this happens you then must dig up and replace your leech field.  Make sure this expensive mistake does not happen to you.

Some in our area have what are called sewage ponds or lagoons and I am personally a big fan of them due to their simple nature, low cost, and almost total lack of maintainance.  That is usually cutting trees from around the edge of it due to the high fertility and the water there. 

You could also have another type of system that I am not aware of.
                          


Joined: Apr 20, 2011
Posts: 10
Location: Rural North Central Indiana
Hi tittiger,

We have a leach field. I've been concerned about my meds. So far just high blood pressure and asthma meds. If it only makes it to the leech field I can live with that. But if it made it to our garden or fruit trees.....
                              


Joined: Apr 25, 2011
Posts: 1
I might be the only one wondering this but why does it matter where you pee?

I pee indoors and transport that pee outdoors for use. 

When I camp I pee outdoors, and yes, if there is privacy I would rather pee outdoors than in a port'o'let.

Permaculture-wise tho' I don't think it matters where the action takes place.

)
Kate Fortesque-McPeake


Joined: Jan 02, 2011
Posts: 28
Location: PA, zone 6b
Right there with you, rlmays.  I use the pee-nice outside, straight into the compost pile, or into the watering can.  But inside I use a plastic yogurt container, especially for the first specimen of the morning, which is typically the most concentrated.  I posted about some simple hacks for pee usage in the garden not long ago on my blog.  Some people just don't have the needed privacy to pee outside.  Some neighbors would just freak out.  But if you carry out a container or a bucket with liquid, they're none the wiser.  Could be you were just saving water from warming up the shower.


http://livingthefrugallife.blogspot.com/ - Homesteading on 2/3 acre in a ruralish suburb - PA, zone 6b
Lightly Burdwood-Porter


Joined: Aug 03, 2010
Posts: 11
I pee inside, (mostly because, the neighbors can see..)  into a little bucket, dilute that with 10 parts water and go and pour it rotationally as much as I can remember... outside on the garden. Especially the Hugulculture (hugelkulture? can't remember...) beds.
Mostly in the morning, when I pee several times before going off to work to the lovely wood shop to make medieval crossbows....
And, in the evenings, when I remember. It is SO easy to simply use the toilet, force of habit. I console myself tho, that we do have septic and at least it is not going anywhere. Sort of....

Hiking and camping, of course, in the woods as much as possible, a skirt makes that easy.... If I am in a desert (often) I ask my companions to stand about me, looking outwards, while I squat.
I have lost, over the years, so much of my inhibitions about peeing and often have to force myself to remember to close the bathroom door (while I pee into the bucket) if the in-laws or other, more easily ..um, well... 'offend-able' folks come to visit.

Best!

DW
                          


Joined: Apr 20, 2011
Posts: 10
Location: Rural North Central Indiana
I just started reading the "Humanure Handbook" by Joseph Jenkins. My husband has been trying to get me to read it for a couple of years, and I finally got to it on my list. Those of you who haven't read it should!
Karen Crane


Joined: May 03, 2011
Posts: 153
When I travel it may be hours before any gas station so I carry toilet paper as well as paper napkins from fast food stops. One time I got really stuck miles from anywhere and had a deep emergency and had to stop and do my thing.....fast....
What I found out was that if you pull over off the road or as far off as possible, and open BOTH side doors ( front and back ) on the passenger side and squat down  at the base of the  front door, you are then shielded by both doors, no one can see you! Further, like I said, I carry toilet paper and napkins for clean up.I also carry those clean wipes for my hands. Keep them in a closed plastic bag iuntil I get home. It may not be the best solution but better than soiling all my clothes and car. 
For just Pee...no problem, the same solution will apply!
I have used this system many times!
                                          


Joined: Feb 03, 2011
Posts: 10
Here's a great resource:

Download/play podcast on "The Under-appreciated Resource in Feces and Urine"

May 9, 2011

Worcester resident and design ecologist Buzz Ferver discusses the nutrients available in human feces and urine, why it's a shame to defecate in toilets full of  clean water, and what you can do to husband your water and "wastewater" resources.

Ferver frequently references The Humanure Handbook, which can be purchased in locally owned bookstores or at the author's website, where it can also be downloaded as an e-book.

Carl Etnier, whose home boasts a Humanure-inspired sawdust toilet and a Swedish, urine-diverting toilet, hosts.
Lee Einer


Joined: May 08, 2011
Posts: 169
jacque g wrote:
I think there are many things to love about peeing outside. But privacy is an issue, and so is snow. I don't mind squatting, but then I don't have knee issues.

For me, the biggest problem is lack of washing facilities near my favorite bushes. Unfortunately, for women, drip drying is just not a great option, as you eventually start to smell like a substandard nursing home. I refuse to leave bits of toilet paper lying around, even buried.

Yet another reason to plant comfrey, or something like it; the leaves of mulch plants could only be better for the soil after being anointed with a bit of urine.

Savannah Thomerson


Joined: Jan 08, 2011
Posts: 78
Location: zone 6
wyldthang wrote:
I pee outside when I'm out there, working in the garden, woods, camping, hiking, etc. Just stand with feet apart, squat all the way down, do it, shake a little, let it dry a little, then go. If you shake and let it dry a little you won't be stinky at the end of the day. DO wash up and change your undies(do I have to say that?).

It's no big deal, and the stretch and stuff it does to your muscels to be able to squat like that is good for you anyways. SOmetimes out hiking etc I'm with a group of people and the cover is sparse, I just walk off aways if it's a pit stop and everyone is grown up enough to not be peeping etc.

My hub has his pee spot by the wood pile, ha. And I'd sure rather pee/poop in the woods than use one of those porta potties.


Agreed.

Peeing outside is the same as peeing inside for me. If I have to pee, it doesn't much matter where I am - I'm going to pee.

That said, wyldthang spelled it out quite well. Find a spot, squat, relieve yourself, shake (this is surely a funny part to behold!), sit a bit to dry and then carry on with  your life

Too much domestication frightens me

On the other mentioned notes, yes we do live way out with the nearest neighbors being roughly a mile away and our gravel driveway being 3 miles long....it's pretty rare that you see another human being out here.

Also, if I'm near the annual beds - even better! I've been known to do a squat-walk around the borders of them (it's supposed to help keep deer away).





www.zenforestliving.blogspot.com
                          


Joined: Apr 20, 2011
Posts: 10
Location: Rural North Central Indiana
I hope I am one of you!  I have been able to replace some of my meds with natural remedies, but unfortunately I have very high blood pressure and as far as I know, there is no replacement for those. I also have asthma and allergies. I have tried natural replacements for those but they did not work. We have a small 5 acre farm that we purchased last fall. We are right next to a state highway here in Indiana. There are some places on our farm were a I could relieve myself with out being viewed, but i'd have to contend with the deer ticks and other stuff my old body isn't sure I can handle. So for me, the composting toilet is the best option. We just finished building our chicken coop and moved our chickens into it. We just got a rabbits and have to finish building the hutches (2 more to go) and finish getting the garden in, then we will start on the toilets. ) I have found this topic very interesting. I am sorry if i caused anyone to have harsh words over my post.
Jeanine Gurley
steward

Joined: May 23, 2011
Posts: 1392
Location: Midlands, South Carolina Zone 7b/8a
    
  10
Pee is a valuable resource - so is a bucket.

I don't like standing in puddles, can't predict where it is going to go, and don't want to be surprised by 6 or 8 legged critters in my pants.

In or near urban areas outdoor evacuation is a real biohazard as I found out in a couple of different countries overseas.  So as not to offend anyone I will not mention which countries but any area near a beach, park, or even heavily travel roadways was covered with human feces and reeked of urine.  This is probably what motivated some cultures to turn to toilets and sewer systems in the first place.

In my mind it is no different than horse or cattle pee or poo; and those animals, if given a choice usually evacuate in specific areas and then eat and sleep somewhere else.  I can't get my dog to figure that out though - she LIKES to sleep in her pee! 

Anyway, the bucket is my answer, it is tall enough for me to sit on, prevents splashing or standing in puddles, and I can use it in designated areas - often areas that I would not be able to squat in even if I wanted to.

This is a great thread and I hope that more people will wise up to the fact that we need to be responsible for our own waste - what ever the source.


1. my projects
zorygirl McCoy


Joined: Jul 01, 2011
Posts: 2
I was brought up a group A. And I pretty much stuck to it through out my life, except for camping in Glacier of course, but after reading this post I decided to give it a try. I read all the posts and honestly it was great! In two days alone I only used a flush toilet twice (once because I couldn't find the flashlight and was afraid to fall in the blackberries at 2 AM). I had no wetness issues and no smell. The bend over butt in the air worked best for me and It doesn't bother my bad knees.

I am now going to mark my property from the coyotes It is a bit liberating I must say. and there is nothing like going out first thing in the morning  and listening to the birds sing and watching the squirrels and deer walk through the yard while taking care of my full bladder.

I thank you to the women who gave me the courage and to Paul for starting this post.

Kris
Savannah Thomerson


Joined: Jan 08, 2011
Posts: 78
Location: zone 6
zorygirl wrote:
I was brought up a group A. And I pretty much stuck to it through out my life, except for camping in Glacier of course, but after reading this post I decided to give it a try. I read all the posts and honestly it was great! In two days alone I only used a flush toilet twice (once because I couldn't find the flashlight and was afraid to fall in the blackberries at 2 AM). I had no wetness issues and no smell. The bend over butt in the air worked best for me and It doesn't bother my bad knees.

I am now going to mark my property from the coyotes It is a bit liberating I must say. and there is nothing like going out first thing in the morning  and listening to the birds sing and watching the squirrels and deer walk through the yard while taking care of my full bladder.

I thank you to the women who gave me the courage and to Paul for starting this post.

Kris



Hoooray!!
                


Joined: Jul 02, 2011
Posts: 6
Hi grandma smith,  I just wanted to mention I have known high blood pressure to be caused by clogged kidneys,  might want to try an herbal kidney cleanse with hydrangea root in it, and a few other herbs usually.  Although I don't have high blood pressure I took some we made a couple years ago and my kidneys have worked much better ever since,  urine darker colored and odor stronger which indicates they're filtering out more than they used to.  And a bunch of tiredness and aches went away. 
     

   
zorygirl McCoy


Joined: Jul 01, 2011
Posts: 2
I have a strange observation that I wanted to pick some brains on.
I am peeing on one of our compost piles ,it is the open kind where we just layer the greens and the browns. So the second day my dog (female) followed me out there and watched me do my thing. Immediately she peed over it when I started to walk away. Now I know alot about dogs so I know it she is marking her territory over mine and that is a dominance thing.
However yesterday when I went out to pee my young goats followed me. Now they are peeing there too. not once but constantly. So today I go out to pee and there is a dog and two goats peeing in my spot ant the same time! WTH? I understand the dog but the goats and Now the dog and goats are pooping there too. I do that business in the toilet.

Any ideas?

I was going to go mark the territory off for the coyotes but after this experience I am worried there will be deer, rabbits, badgers and coyotes peeing there! LOL
                


Joined: Jul 02, 2011
Posts: 6
Experience the power of example!      In general,  animals look up to humans as their leaders,  protectors,  etc.  At least that's how most of our creatures operate.
The one giving the orders and demanding respect is the boss.  I have never seen such a direct follow the leader action as that,  but new things happen all the time. 

  I've been collecting urine and marking my territory,  I fenced in a plot of okra and peanuts with extra tomato stakes and string,  and the deer were stepping through the strings anyway.  Until I started hanging dirty laundry around on the fence and watering it and the stakes with P water.    They haven't entered since.
Wendy Howard


Joined: Jun 29, 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Central Portugal, Zone 8
It amazes me that this conversation is even happening. How on earth did so-called 'civilised' society get to the point of being so incredibly squeamish about a perfectly natural process?! And invest so much disgust and shame in our bodies and their functions? I somehow suspect future generations - if we ever get to that point - will look back on this brief period of history as one of utter insanity.

It seems perfectly natural and 'normal' to me to pee outside. I prefer to pee without a gaggle of onlookers, but if any happen by it isn't the end of the world. Generally I pee where it will be most useful, like under my fruit trees. Sometimes I pee in a bucket and use it along with nettle or comfrey tea to give the veg garden a treat. If it's night and pouring with rain outside I use an old-fashioned bedside potty or make a dash for the Joe Jenkins-style compost toilet. Usually I pick a spot where the ground slopes away from me and squat right down, followed by a few bounces to shake off the drips. I find wiping with something absorbent more comfortable than not so usually have something suitable in my pocket. It goes into the compost bin after use.

And as for getting pee on your skin, many expensive skin-care products contain urea, so consider it part of your beauty regime ... it's also a remedy for athlete's foot ...
James Stark


Joined: Apr 21, 2011
Posts: 79
Location: Manitoba Canada
...just as a side note, in addition to athletes foot, it also relieves the itching of mosquito bites. I rarely wear shoes, and my ankles get chewed to bits in the summer. I was peeing and not really paying attention, and ended up peeing on my ankles, and noticed right away that they didn't itch as bad. Now when I go in my compost pile I stand IN the pile to make sure I get some itch relief too. (Just make sure you rinse off your feet before you go inside. It tends to make for some pretty smelly feet otherwise!)


Sorry if it's a ladies only thread, but I thought it was worth mentioning for everyone.


I never fail. I don't believe in it. I only succeed at finding what doesn't work.
Burra Maluca
Mother Tree

Joined: Apr 03, 2010
Posts: 4585
Location: Portugal Zone 9 Mediterranean Climate
    
173
We suffer from horrid 'ankle biter' flies in Portugal.  I'm now trying to imagine the technique involved to pee on my own ankles... 


What is a Mother Tree ?
James Stark


Joined: Apr 21, 2011
Posts: 79
Location: Manitoba Canada
I am a guy, so it's easy for me, but perhaps going on a rag and wiping down your ankles?
                                


Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 4
Hi, everyone.  New to the forum here, but not new to peeing outside (Totally Group B) and not new to Permaculture.  What a place to introduce myself!  hee hee.

This is a great topic, because it's not like we can avoid these things and some of those outhouses at public places are beyond disgusting.  Talk about bad for us!    And nature, too!

I have a large garden and am outside 8-10 hours some days during the season. I absolutely rely on urine in the compost piles and in plant teas that need some extra nitrogen.  I use a large yogurt container or large cottage cheese container and it's very tidy.  then I immediately dispense it into a plastic gallon milk jug with a screw on cap!  You don't want to know why I wouldn't recommend the snap-on caps!   I always have Kleenex or paper towel in my pocket for lots of reasons, so that's always handy.

If I'm without the container, I've found that bending all the way over and peeing backwards is also very tidy, no ankle issues, no squatting, no backing into thistles!

I have a composting toilet that I have changed the innards, and can swing a funnel into place to detour the urine down a tube to collect it,  depending on the situation.

Urine is a great source of nitrogen and phosphorus, and the price is right!
Wendy Howard


Joined: Jun 29, 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Central Portugal, Zone 8
South Carolina wrote:
I don't like standing in puddles, can't predict where it is going to go, and don't want to be surprised by 6 or 8 legged critters in my pants.


LOL!!! I once took a quick pee before jumping into a friend's truck (we were late for an event), sat down and immediately realised I'd picked up an extra passenger. A wasp. Didn't put me off peeing al fresco, but I take a bit more care to check around myself afterwards now ...
                                    


Joined: Jul 26, 2011
Posts: 1
I use a one quart narrow Rubbermaid pitcher to pee into, fill it with water (one part urine, 9 parts water) and pour it on my veggies.  Very simple, the toilet paper goes in the compost or I use a small baby wash cloth and wash them once a week so not to use paper).  I use a sawdust toilet which allows me to do high heat composting.  I haven't had to buy soil or fertilizer for 4 years now...
                              


Joined: Aug 02, 2011
Posts: 1
I live in the country (28 acres in the woods) and I am having problem being comfortable peeing at my own place.
Funny thing is that I will shower out doors, & pee then!

What people have been saying on this page has helped me to find a comfortable way to do it. I like the person that said something about the water bottle.  If you us a small bottle that is soft, it could be squeezed to shoot water onto you like a bidets.  Then I would think that you wouldn't smell & have your underwear deteriorate as it does from the urine.

Yes I am shy about being outside, it is the smell and the dirty feel that makes me not do it as a norm.  I have gone outside, and I do shake the area, just not to my satisfaction.

The HUMANURE bucket would be the best way for me.  It was the feel of being dirty that I don't like.  Also, I don't like the idea of having TP in my compost pile, yes it will dissolve.  There are heavy chemicals that they use to make paper products, not something I want in my, trying to be, organic garden.  So in comes the idea of the water bottle.  (I am a trucker that has hauled paper products & my property is 1 mile from a paper mill.)

One thought about the Humanure toilet is that you need to have it composted for a year. Year 1 - collect. Year 2 - set.  Year 3 - use on the garden as fertilizer.  That means that you would have to have a compost pile system that would let you do it.  There are many gardeners that do use it.  It is as one of the people writing stated (maybe on different forum, stated about poop) about the tape worm and other bugs from human & animal poop.  That is why it needs to be composted for awhile before using in the garden, kill the bugs!!

Thank you for all of the ideas that were shared.  Even though they might not have touched on the topic you intended, there thoughts and comments did give me an idea.
Suzy Bean
steward

Joined: Apr 05, 2011
Posts: 940
Location: Stevensville, MT
    
    8
Found this while using stumbleupon: http://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/main/w-global/w-news/w-latest_news/w-news-outdoor-peeing-could-activate-a-composting-revolution.htm


www.thehappypermaculturalist.wordpress.com
gani et se


Joined: Apr 24, 2011
Posts: 214
Location: Douglas County OR
    
    1
except... left out again. from the article:
"There are obvious logistical benefits to limiting it to male members of the team, but also male pee is preferable to women’s, as the male stuff is apparently less acidic."
Humph! she said acidly.

guess i better add a bit of lime to MY pee bale
gani


Intermountain (Cascades and Coast range) oak savannah, 550 - 600 ft elevation. USDA zone 7a. Arid summers, soggy winters
nursel Hatfield


Joined: Sep 09, 2011
Posts: 1
Hi ladies, I didn't go through all 4 pages on this topic but I thought I would alert you to a product that might make your lives easier. http://www.go-girl.com/ offers a reusable/ washable medical grade silicone cup with nosel that allows you to pee while standing, without the mess. you simply hold the cup to your groin and go!  they are also for sale on amazon.com check them out!
from their website: "Re-Usable and Earth Friendly
Because GoGirl is reusable, it’s environmentally smart. Our active lifestyle girls are our most loyal customers and they love that it’s reusable. The medical-grade silicone is so tough it can withstand boiling water and remains supple. It’s easy to re-use your GoGirl. Wash with soap and water, and dry. The medical-grade silicone dries quickly and you can shake it lightly to help dry. "

Kat deZwart


Joined: Aug 13, 2011
Posts: 103
Location: Limburg, Netherlands, sandy loam
    
    1
My parents are not even familiar with the term permaculture, but peeing outside was just something you do when you're way back in the garden or out hiking. No fuzz, just doing what comes naturally. Since then, I've peed outside directly in my compostheap while I lived on e 260m2 lot in the middle of the city and in my bigger garden that I own now. My upstairs bathroom hasn't got a toilet, so I bought a cheap campingtoilet like this: http://www.amazon.com/PORTABLE-TOILET-Outdoor-Camping-Recreation/dp/B0012Y29QQ/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1316438588&sr=8-4 And every few days I carry the container to the compostheap and dump the contents. Easypeasy!
                                      


Joined: Oct 20, 2011
Posts: 1
Actually someone makes a gizmo to use for peeing standing up: 

http://www.go-girl.com/

I think there are other brands too.  never used one, but it looks pretty cool.
 
 
subject: women peeing outdoors
 
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